Club FC operational costs

[holmberg]

Over on the General Formula Car Discussion topic, I've been conducting a survey of operational costs for each class. Here I'm only interested in costs that differ significantly between the classes, and not, for example, entrance fees, hotel, food, etc.

Drivers from some classes have responded with data for their class, and the result is a spreadsheet in Google docs.

Here's what I have for this class. If you have changes, please reply below, and I will update the spreadsheet.

Class name: CFC

Engine make: Ford

Engine model: Pinto

Displacement: 2000

Power at crank, HP: 145

Torque at crank, ft-lbs: 135

Weight with driver, lbs: 1,200

Purchase new, $: original price and year?

Purchase used, $: ?

Tires set, $: 750 American Racer 825 compound

Tire competitive heat cycles: 13

Engine rebuild, $: 7,500

Engine competitive hours: 27

Fuel $/gallon: 4.50

Fuel gallons/hour: 10

Brake pads set, $: 200

Brake pads hours: 10

Other operational costs, $:

Thanks,

Greg Holmberg

[troyt]

New prices varied widely but are no longer meaningful as most Club's CFC rules require a car 20+ years old. Current pricing on CFCs are $10K-$25K, with $15K-$20K for a good runner seeming to be market pricing.
Tires - depends on the Club and Series. The American Racer f1000 tire for $750 might turn into a popular option, but currently the Avon A11s for $1200 seem to be the faster tire. Good for two race weekends.

[EricP]

$7,500? That seems high, no?

[kea]

I think most of my customer run much more then 27 hours between rebuilds. But, as a many of them are never on this site, I doubt they will chime in.
As for Brake Pads, around here most of them run KFP Magnum pads. The compounds they like for the LD-20 calipers run $74.00 - $85.00 per axle (4 pads) and the LD-19, $66.00 - $75.00 per axle. Pad life depends on the circuit they run (some are harder on pads then others), which caliper set-up they have and their personal driving style.
Also, they prefer the bias Hoosier tires.

[holmberg]

OK, here's what I have now.

Class name: CFC
Engine make: Ford
Engine model: Pinto
Displacement: 2000
Power at crank, HP: 145
Torque at crank, ft-lbs: 135
Weight with driver, lbs: 1,200
Purchase new, $: original price and year?
Purchase used, $: 20,000
Tires set, $: 950 Hoosier bias
Tire competitive heat cycles: 8
Engine rebuild, $: 5,000
Engine competitive hours: 53
Fuel $/gallon: 4.50
Fuel gallons/hour: 10
Brake pads set, $: 150
Brake pads hours: 10
Gearbox rebuild: ?
Gearbox hours: ?
Other operational costs, $:

[kea]

As for Gearbox rebuilds that I see, they are far and few between. The LD-200 lasts even longer then the Mk8/9 series. And with more modern lubricants like Redline Shock-Proof Light, the CWP's see incredible life. If you check the gearsets and replace them when the signs tell you then this part of your race car will be fairly trouble free.
I think the shift joints wear out faster then most gearbox items.

[Rick Kirchner]

I'd agree with that keith. I think my R&P had nearly 100 weekends on it before it ended replacing. Never have replaced a dog or a gearset either.

Once I spent the $ on apex joints my linkage doesn't wear either.

Based on my last one the bottom end will go at least 40 hours. I think the AL head helps with this - as the OP is much higher at temp, less is gushing out of the older style bearings that arena the iron head.

I send the head back about every 12 hours, the re-build is about $400

I did have one of the big name builders quote me $7500 for a standard re-build, shipping, and a set of the new Ivey pistons.

[Buc01]

Class name: CFC - FS

Engine make: Ford

Engine model: Pinto

Displacement: 2000

Power at crank, HP: 200

Torque at crank, ft-lbs: 140

Weight with driver, lbs: Never weighed the car

Purchase new, $: 1991 VD FC

Purchase used, $: 7,500

Tires set, $: Used Hoosier R35A - Price varies depending upon heat cycles ($200-600)

Tire competitive heat cycles: 15

Engine rebuild, $: I did not add it up on purpose!

Engine competitive hours: On my first rebuild (8 races and counting! - Quicksilver)

Fuel $/gallon: 9.00 - 110 Octane

Fuel gallons/hour: 6 laps per gallon on 1.8 mile 11 turn circuit (twin weber 44 IDF carbs)

Brake pads set, $: KFP Magnum from Keith Averill. LD-20 front, LD-19 rear

Brake pads hours: 3-4 race weekends
Gearbox: LD-200. Pull gears and inspect after each race. Going strong, no rebuild from when I bought car
CV Joints: TDI lightened CV's at start of season. Have pulled them once. Looked great $ 158 each.

Aaron

[holmberg]

Class name: CFC - FS

Engine make: Ford

Engine model: Pinto

Displacement: 2000

Power at crank, HP: 200

Torque at crank, ft-lbs: 140

Weight with driver, lbs: Never weighed the car

Purchase new, $: 1991 VD FC

Purchase used, $: 7,500

Tires set, $: Used Hoosier R35A - Price varies depending upon heat cycles ($200-600)

Tire competitive heat cycles: 15

Engine rebuild, $: I did not add it up on purpose!

Engine competitive hours: On my first rebuild (8 races and counting! - Quicksilver)

Fuel $/gallon: 9.00 - 110 Octane

Fuel gallons/hour: 6 laps per gallon on 1.8 mile 11 turn circuit (twin weber 44 IDF carbs)

Brake pads set, $: KFP Magnum from Keith Averill. LD-20 front, LD-19 rear

Brake pads hours: 3-4 race weekends
Gearbox: LD-200. Pull gears and inspect after each race. Going strong, no rebuild from when I bought car
CV Joints: TDI lightened CV's at start of season. Have pulled them once. Looked great $ 158 each.

Aaron

A very interesting option for Pinto-powered cars. Should produce lap-times similar to F1000! Assuming 1200 lbs required for FC, that's a weight/(power+torque) ratio of 3.52. FB is 3.85 and P1 is 3.53. So your car is somewhere near those for lap times. Depending on tires and down-force, of course.

I can't calculate an operational cost without the engine rebuild cost and a number of hours the engine will go without being down on power.

I don't think I'll put it in the spreadsheet since it's not an official class, but it's fun to hear about!

[Buc01]

A very interesting option for Pinto-powered cars. Should produce lap-times similar to F1000! Assuming 1200 lbs required for FC, that's a weight/(power+torque) ratio of 3.52. FB is 3.85 and P1 is 3.53. So your car is somewhere near those for lap times. Depending on tires and down-force, of course.

I can't calculate an operational cost without the engine rebuild cost and a number of hours the engine will go without being down on power.

I don't think I'll put it in the spreadsheet since it's not an official class, but it's fun to hear about!

You are correct. I run very similar times to Majors level F1000 and FC at Hallett. Of course my car is not SCCA legal, but I do not ever intend to race with them. I run in a class that groups ALL winged formula cars together, so I built the engine to be competitive with whatever may show up. Last time out, a Pro Mazda showed up. Was dead even with him down the straight bits.

Honestly, I would say the engine rebuild/upgrade was in the $ 7,500 range. Had to import a lot of go fast parts from across the big pond.

Aaron

[BeerBudgetRacing]

You are correct. I run very similar times to Majors level F1000 and FC at Hallett. Of course my car is not SCCA legal, but I do not ever intend to race with them. I run in a class that groups ALL winged formula cars together, so I built the engine to be competitive with whatever may show up. Last time out, a Pro Mazda showed up. Was dead even with him down the straight bits.

Honestly, I would say the engine rebuild/upgrade was in the $ 7,500 range. Had to import a lot of go fast parts from across the big pond.

Aaron

Why ddn't you just set the Pinto aside and build a Honda or Mazda engine for 200hp.? Probably would have cost less and have cheaper rebuilds..... if you're going off book, why stick with the Pinto?

[Buc01]

Why ddn't you just set the Pinto aside and build a Honda or Mazda engine for 200hp.? Probably would have cost less and have cheaper rebuilds..... if you're going off book, why stick with the Pinto?

That is what fits in the car. Did not want to redesign all the engine mounts etc.

AS

[holmberg]

OK, it appears that all the discussions in all the communities have died out, so you can find the results in the spreadsheet.