Ralt RT5 “naked slider”

[Dan Lipperini Jr]

I’m hoping the “naked slider” title would get your attention and have you read through the thread.

Good morning, my name is Dan and I’m an addict! Seriously, I pick up projects/strays and then kick myself once I get them back to the shop and this is not different. I found a project car that a gentleman had been storing in his garage for the last 15 years and reluctantly bought it. I probably have no business owning it as only bad things will ever come from it being in the shop. I’ve wanted to build a FAST Hillclimb toy for many years and pulled the trigger on this one thinking it would be a good platform to build from. Several things are telling me this might not be a good choice. After meeting with the seller, he informs me that this car was the SCCA FC RunOffs winner in 85/86/87 at the hands of Lou Rettenmeier! DAMN! Probably not a good car to cut-up and modify as it’s probably worth something to someone to restore back to its former glory. I will not be the person for that due to the time, effort and $$$ to do it correctly. I could see dropping a modern 4-cylinder(Ecotec/Duratec), drysumping it and running the car. That would be more within my budget. I know that isn’t a good use for the car, but I have it now.

Anyway, here is what I ended up with, the complete “slider”. The complete monocoque, transaxle, shocks/springs, Dymags(6&8’s), BBS(8&10’s), rotors, Alcon calipers, radiator, oil cooler, dash, wiring harness, header, water lines and most importantly the logbooks. The original bodywork went missing years ago along with the engine. Oh well, nothing that can be done about it as it was a decade ago that it happened.

So I’m here to ask for advise. Do I attempt to compile all of the necessary parts and restore the car? Since I have no connection to this particular vehicle and the cost involved would probably exceed the completed value, this really isn’t going to happen. Sell it to someone who will either restore it or use it to support another RT5 that they are running. Maybe someone has a spare engine and bodywork, therefore putting this one back together would be much easier. Possibly advertise it to the vintage crowd(SVRA or other group) and ask their advise? I’m out of my element here so I’m asking for input.

[Dan Lipperini Jr]

Looks like I should have posted this in the Vintage Atlantic and SuperVee section. Can a moderator please move this to the appropriate area. Thank-You.

[Charles Warner]

Dan,

It looks like it's all there. Find an engine from the VW crowd and source the bodywork (which may be more difficult). Then you are faced with a lot of grunt work cleaning and inspecting and replacing parts as the entire chassis will need dismantling and cleaning, but it should be a labor of love so time is immaterial. After seeing the pictures I don't think you have an insurmountable task. And, if you can verify its provenance, it should be worth something.

Not a bad find. If it was an RT-4 I'd take it off your hands in a heartbeat.

[billtebbutt]

Dan, you've done exactly what I have done, so many times. Is it faulty DNA?

I am no expert, but i "think" you can buy an RT5 complete in ok condition for the mid $20k level. At that price, regardless of how little you paid for it, you'd be upside down if you restored it.

Vintage racing is where it is at. Out there is a guy with a spare water-cooled VW, looking for a project. Or, she, has an RT5 with a ton of spares, looking to build out a second car. This is for him/her. That's where i would advertise it..........

cheers,
BT

[Dan Lipperini Jr]

Provenance shouldn’t be a problem as the logbook shows when/who raced the car. That hopefully proves what it is even though I can’t find the original chassis tag. It isn’t with the paperwork that I have with the car unfortunately. It was “re-tubbed”by Marc Bahner years ago(1995) and the front bulkhead is stamped. I also have the paperwork from SCCA for the new tub.

[Phil Creighton]

Louis Rettenmeier's old RT5 I think - pretty sure it won the Runoffs at least twice in the 80's. Sure could pedal that thing
As many RT5 s that Ben Beasley converted to SR he would be my first call for bodywork takeoffs
Phil

[E1pix]

If lineage is of interest, I’m reasonably certain this car was run by Bruce Miller’s North Shore Racing in New York in the day. I’m also equally semi-certain it’s the same RT-5 driven by Mark Brainard for a few prior years, from the same shop.

I hand-lettered some details on Brainard’s car at the Runoffs in 1982, for Bruce, and again when Rettenmaier drove it — again, all dependent on memory of this being a North Shore car here.

Along these lines, RIP Craig Hogan......... not forgotten.


Also, if indeed you need a prep shop to renew the car, I cannot recommend Steve Wulff at Performance Development & Racing in North Carolina enough. PM for contact info if needed. Not only did he race a RT-5 in the Pro series in 1989, he was the Team Manager for RuSport (AJ Allmendinger, Justin Wilson, and Cristiano da Matta) in IndyCar and is one fine guy I’ve known for over 40 years.

[HazelNut]

If lineage is of interest, I’m reasonably certain this car was run by Bruce Miller’s North Shore Racing in New York in the day.

Bruce is still around and I'm sure he's got records for it if he took care of it back in the day. I believe this is a current phone number for him 631-807-6180

[E1pix]

Super cool, Thanks for that!!!

I’ll call him ASAP. He is one good guy.

[Bob L.]

Boy, does that look and sound familiar! I bought a 83 RT5 a couple of years ago...bit earlier than yours, complete car with a "fresh" Engine Development injected engine (30 years ago)..... Thought it was a too good a deal to pass up....wrong. Now on the downhill of total rehab from bare tub...... slowly, going back together... Keco'd the mag bits, replated the shiny stuff, shined up the tub, new cell, dyno'd the shocks, repaired front of tub (ran over stuff during it's life)....tons of other little stuff. Can confirm how easy to get quickly over one's skis and pocketbook, on these.... neat cars, but little place for them in vintage...usually have to run as FA's, and just can't hang with real ones.....not many 1600 Rabbits/engines in junk yards today.....1800, 8vs rare, too.

Yours is later pull rod front, a fair amt. of "province/heritage". Hope you take it on/finish...find it a good home or run...need some more out there. Feel free to call for chat/commiseration/advice.....So often, love is blind.

Bob L.

[provamo]

go for it.........................somebody!

[Stan Clayton]

I seem to have missed the asking price.

[Dee]

I restored Rodger Penske Jr / Davy Jones RT 5 years ago and still run it around the country today, its got a 1835 cc power plant and run well with the FA cars . Great bang for the buck
Dee
RT 5
Swift 016

[RussMcB]

I started racing in the northeast in the mid 1980's, lived near Hartford so spent plenty of time at LRP. Lou's car always looked great and, IIRC, he usually won. I think it had Newman's Own sponsorship. I would really like to see it restored, but that's easy for me to say since I don't have to do the work or spend the money.

It looks like Lou is in Leeds, AL now: https://www.linkedin.com/in/louis-c-...meier-b05773b3

[Dan Lipperini Jr]

Yes sir, same car.

[RussMcB]

Oh, that looks great. Brings me back, especially since it looks like the logbook pictures were taken at Bryar Motorsports Park.

[stonebridge20]

I'm pretty sure Lou won the Runoffs 85,86,87 with that car when it was classed as a FC

[Steve Demeter]

Correct. At least that is the correct livery. IIRC Mark Brainard had an RT-1 in 1982, as he and I are form the same town. That was also the first year Keith Averill ran his RT-1 IIRC.

[2fast2stop]

Dan,

It looks like it's all there. Find an engine from the VW crowd and source the bodywork (which may be more difficult). Then you are faced with a lot of grunt work cleaning and inspecting and replacing parts as the entire chassis will need dismantling and cleaning, but it should be a labor of love so time is immaterial. After seeing the pictures I don't think you have an insurmountable task. And, if you can verify its provenance, it should be worth something.

Not a bad find. If it was an RT-4 I'd take it off your hands in a heartbeat.

In SCCA they were FC, in Bosch Pro Series they were SV. Charlie, didn't the '86 and later cars have pushrods on all corners. I was looking to see if the gearbox rear cover had the casting for the rear wing mount. Some new cherry max rivets, new AN bolts, rod ends, some elbow grease.........good as new.

I'm restoring my T328SV ,HU97, imported in '77, no. 16 of 18. It's one of a few late cars that were water cooled. Right now it's just a tub ready for polishing. I do have the RT5 rear gearbox cover and an RT5 two element rear wing which should be a huge upgrade from the Lola rear wing.

FGM

[Dan Lipperini Jr]

The rear cover does have the casting for the wing mount, unfortunately the wing and mount went missing with the bodywork.

[Charles Warner]

Charlie, didn't the '86 and later cars have pushrods on all corners.
FGM

The front suspension from 1984 on was pull/push rod. The rear suspension was rocker until 1988 when they tried pull rod suspension on the rear. Unsuccessful. Cars were converted back to 1986 spec.

[Dan Lipperini Jr]

Back with an interesting update. On 11-22 I got a call from my brother asking if I still had the Ralt. I did but told him that I had several conversations with interested parties and working to move it on to a new owner. He told me not to sell it to anyone as he had someone who wanted the car. He received a call from Lou Rettenmeier asking about the car and for a way for him to contact me. So, the following day I had a long conversation with Lou and he expressed his interest in getting the car back. He explained that he still had some original bodywork for the car hanging in his shop all these years later and that he car isn’t actually for him. He wanted to get it back so his son could have it to race. Of all the thing that could be done with this car, the offers that I had to purchase it as-is and parts that were offered to me to rebuild it, this was the right conversation to have. With everything that I’ve done with my family in racing, it’s those memories that I hold dearest. If I can “pay it forward” and reunite this car with its former owner who is going to use it again with his family, then that’s the right place for it to go. When my father was at the shop the other day I told him where the car was going. He smiled and told me that I “did the right thing” and that he was “proud of me” for doing it. Even at 55 years old, hearing that from my dad, that he was “proud” that I made sure it was going “home”, makes me feel good and a bit sentimental. I hope Lou and his son have many years together restoring and racing the car. The car truly found it’s way home............

[RussMcB]

Woo hoo! That's awesome. It will be great to see the car again as it was. Should be a great father/son project.

[Robert J. Alder]

Wonderful ending.

I had the same experience back in 2012 when restoring a Ralt T-620 Super Vee. I guy called from Calif, said he thought might be his old car, came to Denver and was about 30 feet from it and said, "Yup. That's my car." (A side pod fitting instantly gave it away.).

He had purchased it new. Bought it for his son to race. Cool stuff.

[E1pix]

Great ending indeed, I love it!

Thanks for posting the car/trailer photo! I lettered the Texas Light logo on the trailer, and almost sure the NSR stuff, too. Looks like my script on “New York,” but don’t recall doing the car marques so think I didn’t.

Screen-captured, Thanks Again!

[starfmguy]

I agree. This summer I bought a 1980 Crossle 40F and it turns out I drove this car back in 1993. Lots of great memories, pictures, my signature in the log book, etc. It was well maintained, updated, and it looks even better now ! Great fun to race it again. Funny how you get attached... so I know the feeling. I love this car !!!

[John Nesbitt]

It is too bad that Apexspeed does not have a "Thread of the Year". This one would certainly qualify for the 2020 award.

[Dan Lipperini Jr]

It’s funny that this thread pops back up today. We just loaded the car/parts on his trailer and Lou just left my shop. He has a long drive back to Alabama where he snd his son will begin their journey into restoring his old car. It went back to the right place, it went back to the right owner and it went back home.

Thanks Lou, I hope you and your son have many good times with the car.