Engine install checklist

[JRO183]

The motors make and break this class at the same time. These engines are really cool but at the same time, have ZERO tolerance for something installed wrong.

I would like to start a database of tips on engine install/maint tips so as a group we can learn from our mistakes and hopefully stop some of the mainly self inflicted engine failures. Maybe the moderator could sticky this so we can help our class stay on track.

-use stainless steel braided oil lines or at least add a clamp around the barbed fitting. The engine compartments get very hot and I just had a oil line blow off a barbed fitting.

-safety wire rad cap. They can loosen. (Has done it twice on me)

-safety wire oil cap. Has came off once on me.

-put a hose clamp around the oil filter and safety wire to it to keep filter from loosening.

-put a piece of tape on access plugs on right side of engine. I have had them back out and then u loose all he oil.

-make sure you install hose clamps correctly. This is so easy to screw up. Engine areas are tight and it is hard to verify they are on properly. I have cooked a couple motors because a hose came off.

-think about installing a water pressure sensor in your data. If you loose a hose or radiator, a warning light will let u know before the engine goes nuclear.

- make sure you put on fuel cap. Easy to forget if in a rush.

-if you run your car out of fuel, consider installing a new fuel pump. They are very fragile and tend to quit working not long after running dry.

-if u lose oil pressure, pull motor out and get main bearings installed. It does not take hardly anytime to burn a bearing from low oil pressure. Once that happens the motor will blow if you keep running it.

-make sure the crankcase breather line is not kinked or blocked. If so, u will blow the countershaft sprocket seal and loose all the oil.

-make sure oil level is correct. I run the motor to 4000 rpm and make sure oil is at top of window, then add 1/3 quart.

-I drill out thermostat, so when I fill engine with water I do not have to wait for it to open to ensure all the air is out. This saves problems, especially when in a rush.

-careful with Ballisic batteries. If u run a geartronics or lots of amperage, they may quait on you. I had 2- 12 cells die. Seems like they do not like to be drawn down.

Please add to the list with your thoughts guys.

Thanks,

J.R.O

[ghickman]

There's no replacing being UBER prepared before you leave for the track, I think we all know that.

1) There are several screws on the GSXR1000 engine covers that are thru tapped right into the case. These screws require a washer that has a rubber o-ring that is molded into it. I've seen people forget to put these in the correct order and end up dumping oil all over. Make sure you are using the proper torque value when installing these and use plenty of blue loctite.

2) To further what JR was talking about on hose clamps, I go as far to saftey wire them so they can't back off. Oh and use the highest quality hose clamps money can buy. I prefer the type that are shielded so when tightening that don't bite into the hose.

3) Use the highest quality steel braided hose you can get. I also recommend before installing them pressure test them. You can make a test rig very easily. We test them to at least 200 psi.

4) Make sure your fire system is plumbed correct and is fully functioning. I recommend a nozzle in front of the engine and one at the back of the engine positioned so it can spray directly at the fuel rail. There have been several cars either destroyed by fire or close to it. I prefer the mother earth friendly HALON SYSTEMS, forget what its called but it works.

5) In case you do blow an engine make sure you have a really good scatter blanket in front of the engine. Make sure it fits tightly to the engine so that oil can't spray all over the headers. If you have a sloppy installation and you throw a rod it will turn into a nasty fire.

I'll add more to this thread as I think of stuff.

[Mike B]

Stuck.

Be sure to specify engine model/year if your advice is engine-specific. I'm pretty sure all of JR's tips apply to the 07/08 Suzuki but most are good tips for any engine install.

[BennyBad]

when changing oil and filter
always double and triple check you don't leave the old filter gasket behind on engine block, becomes a very expensive mistake

[Revs2-12k]

Good thread, subscribing.

-careful with Ballisic batteries. If u run a geartronics or lots of amperage, they may quait on you. I had 2- 12 cells die. Seems like they do not like to be drawn down.
Thanks, J.R.O

Batteries = Defined life span...

I wish I would have read this B4 this past weekend at WGI. My Ballistic battery failed, 8 laps into the race. It had 2 minimal draw downs that I know of.

[Ivinsea]

-think about installing a water pressure sensor in your data. If you loose a hose or radiator, a warning light will let u know before the engine goes nuclear.

I had never thought of that. Great idea.

3) Use the highest quality steel braided hose you can get. I also recommend before installing them pressure test them. You can make a test rig very easily. We test them to at least 200 psi.

Would is be possible to pressure test the ENTIRE oiling system in situ to say, 100 psi? The hoses, the hose connections, the oil cooler, oil filter etc.


My suggestions:
1) Always warm up the oil to at least 150*F before racing.
2) Replace or clean oil lines & cooler EXTREMELY well after a blow up.

[glenn cooper]

EVERY fastener that holds fluids needs safety wired.

On the K7/K8 GSXR1000:

There is a bolt that I use for engine oil priming, situated above the #1 header. If that bolt backs out, you'll be spraying oil onto the header...

The clutch slave cylinder has 2 bolts which are red locktighted from the factory.
Drill and wire these, as if they come off, the slave will fall and hang by the clutch hyd line, and the clutch outer pushrod will be forcibly ejected by a hot stream of oil, followed real quickly by the remaining 6 quarts or so...

NEVER attempt to start an engine that has not been primed with oil.
If it is a new build, and the builder had or provided the wet oil pan, chances are they primed the oil pump by hand prior to clutch install, and you are most likely good to go, but still need to ensure adequate oil pressure. Bleed the oil line going to the sensor by cranking the engine until it weeps at the sensor, then tighten.

The filter may need to be loosened and engine cranked until oil weeps there, then tighten.

Bleed the remaining air by loosening the bolt above the #1 header, until oil weeps there.

Having a spare engine that is fully dressed with all oil lines, drilled, safety wired, primed, spare oil cooler will allow the difference between getting a good nights sleep or not.

If you suspect engine overheating (over 230 or so) it would behoove you to remove and replace the engine. I'm even considering removing the torque from the head bolts immediately after coming off an overheat episode as I believe the failures immediately following overheats are due to cylinder head gaskets getting tweaked during the thermal events. Then remove head when cool, and replace head gasket. I don't even know if this will work, but I do know you'll grenade one the next time you run it.

If running a drysump GSXR, the oil return/left side port will need to be drilled out, usually done when engine is getting built. Tap the drilled passage for a block off plug in the event the engine needs to be run in a wetsump configuration where that passage is NOT drilled out, but can now easily be plugged.
Attempting to run an engine in the drysump/drilled return port, in a wet pan application will see not much in the way of oil flow, but very much in the way of oil temp.

[Richard Dziak]

Buy a CTEK 3300 Battery minder charger at Amazon.com and keep your battery charged all the time. You will not get a failed battery or low voltage drop. There won't be any disappointments at the track.

I use one of these to keep my Jaguar XKR consistently charged. Also used one of these when racing my F1000. Never had a battery failure.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

[RobLav]

FE36 is not anywhere near the capability of Halon. I also agree with Gary on the two nozzle locations.

Although heavier, the old PC680 battery ran and ran and ran for many years with never an issue. Instead of "penny wise pound foolish", how about pound wise penny foolish"!?

When I went to re-use an AN6 fuel line fitting from the Kawi for another project, the line had a slight split in it. I now suspect that was the cause of my fire. This was the line leading to the fuel rail. I got real lucky that a cornerworker was right there and able to put the fire out as soon as I stopped.

For those of us that rebuild our own engines, never re-use rod bolts.

[glenn cooper]

Buy a CTEK 3300 Battery minder charger at Amazon.com and keep your battery charged all the time. You will not get a failed battery or low voltage drop. There won't be any disappointments at the track.

I use one of these to keep my Jaguar XKR consistently charged. Also used one of these when racing my F1000. Never had a battery failure.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

The electric water pump, plus the Geartronics air compressor that are both on my car in Kawi-Configuration draw a bunch of amps.

I agree that a car w/ unassisted shifting and no elec water pump should be fine w/ the small dry cell batt's, but No Mas for me...

[glenn cooper]

I had never thought of that. Great idea.


Would is be possible to pressure test the ENTIRE oiling system in situ to say, 100 psi? The hoses, the hose connections, the oil cooler, oil filter etc?
No...

My suggestions:
1) Always warm up the oil to at least 150*F before racing.
2) Replace or clean oil lines & cooler EXTREMELY well after a blow up.

...

..............

[Revs2-12k]

After having 2 header bolts come loose at NJMP, I've upgraded to Stage 8 Locking fasteners on my Suzuki K7/8 header bolts.

Link ---> http://www.stage8.com/

4 CYLINDER = Using 8mm bolts
Stage 8 P/N 4926
(10) 8mm-1.25x25mm bolts 6pt Dual Hex Head w/integral Allen Head

[provamo]

following this thread..................suprised at all that work for a street-bike engine ..........but it is a highly stressed machine and the application is unique

[Northwind]

following this thread..................suprised at all that work for a street-bike engine ..........but it is a highly stressed machine and the application is unique

There are probably more people that have not done anything special to the fasteners on these motors and are running reliable. I think most of the issues are related to the thrashing to get the cars running in a hurry. Things get overlooked when you are in a hurry. All these preventative measures just add fiddle factor and compound the time /hurry factor. Attention to detail and not jumping around to different systems of the car before the other is finished will prevent many potential issues. However some of these tips could be helpful if you have a repeat problem.

These cars are not as bad as this thread makes them sound.

[glenn cooper]

would apply to ANY racecar, regardless of engine: safety wiring drains and fills, ensuring tightness, priming oil systems. I really don't see it as a "these cars" type deal, rather a "racecar" deal...

Many of the folks commenting on here are running races quite often; my log book is almost filled up on the RFR, so the odds would point to the fact that JR, myself and some of the others who run quite a bit will see stuff that others might not.

Dan, I hear ya on the "jumping around" thing, as I am super "guilty" of this, but sometimes you have to do that, especially working solo.

[Nick77]

Glen it happens when three of us are working also

It's the way it is when you have a lot to do in a short period of time to get to the next race
Nick

[James Michael]

This is all good advice and much appreciated. I just had an engine fire last weekend at High Plains. Not sure the cause but it looks like some type of oil leak on the RHS (loose filter, split or leaking hose etc) but will know more this weekend.
I think part of the problem is with these engines, the hot headers are sitting next to the oil lines and very close to the oil filter (wasn't this way with my old Swift DB-1), so you have to be extra cautious that there is no leaking oil that can cause a fire. Some way to prevent leaking oil from getting onto the headers would be a nice invention.

James

[Northwind]

Dan, I hear ya on the "jumping around" thing, as I am super "guilty" of this, but sometimes you have to do that, especially working solo.[/QUOTE]


I am also working solo so I know what it takes to prep a car and build development parts just for my race attendance schedule. It makes me very impressed with how committed that you and JRO are for the schedules that you two run. You guys are incredible considering that you have day jobs and dedicated to a level that most can't even imagine. For those that don't know what the "jumping around thing" is I try to work on a specific system in it's entirety before I move to the next. Fuel system: lines, fittings, routing, etc. Oil systems: lines, fittings, routings, etc. Electrical system: routing and connections. And so on. It helps me with not forgetting or missing the tasks at hand.

[Richard Dziak]

While I am not actively racing in F1000 any longer, I made sure that 2 weeks before any race event that I personally went over (inspected) the car carefully. All safety wired parts were in tact and secure. Body fasteners replaced where needed. Making sure that every nut and bolt from the front to the rear of the car was tight and inspected. Oil and filter changes were complete and the engine run. Made sure that all telemetry and gauges were working properly and providing accurate readouts/data. I made sure that all fluid levels, water, oil, brake fluids were up to proper levels. Made sure that battery voltage was 100%. Made sure that all oil lines, water hoses, brake lines were all in tact and tightened to proper levels. I had a race check list that I made up, and made sure that before every event the list had a checkmark by every item before even getting to the track.

I found that in the 10 years of racing within the SCCA, way to many drivers transported their cars to the track, then began working on them. In the rush of time, excitement of racing, and at track conversation, it was so easy to make mistakes and eliminate neccessary items in the car prep.

Yes, there are events when special circumstances come about during a race, but spending proper time to inspect, repair and make sure that the race car is 100% ready to race well in advance of the event will certainly eliminate many problems.

Making the long tows to the race track, prepping at car at the track, practicing, qualifying, racing, takes a toll on the physical body and mental conditioning of any racer. Then trying to make repairs or prepping leaves lots of room for mistakes, errors, and possible problems when on the track.

A well prepped and prepared racer is a good racer at the track, and eliminates lots of potential problems.

Just my .02 cents worth.

[JRO183]

I think most everyone would agree to show up at the track prepared. I have put my guts into this year and have spent hundreds of hours preparing and fixing the car at the shop prior to races. But even with proper prep, things happen. This thread was merely to help point out what to look for even when everything looks good. I did not show up to Sears Point with a loose oil fitting, the oil line came off the fully tightened fitting. I did not show up to Atlanta with a loose radiator cap, but it backed off and let the water out. I think we can all learn from our experiences and try to help educate the class on what things that have failed in the past and what to look out for in the future.

[924RACR]

I do pressure test my cooling system - but only to the cap rating! 'Bout 20psi.

I'd hate to see what 100psi would do to my radiator...

I will say that I do rather like the added confidence (with all my history of engine cooling problems, many due to leaks) of knowing the system is tight and without leaks.

[James Michael]

FYI - per my earlier post, the reason for my fire appears to be a split oil line. This was actually the shorter line that returns the oil to the engine on the right hand side. I had the longer line covered with insulation but the shorter line sat under it and was not insulated.
I will say I did have to change that shorter line that split years ago (2008 I think), and I bought it from an industrial hose outfit. It is not as high a quality as the other hose. It has a smooth surface to it unlike the other hose that has a rougher surface. It did not leak at the ends, it appears the split was in the middle of the hose, and I believe it split on the bottom where is sat against the floor. I did have the engine cover off before the race, and do not recall seeing any seeping oil but then again, I wasn't looking at that area very closely.
Not sure the pressure rating difference, but Pegasus sells the better stuff. I did not have steel braiding on my hoses.
Hind sight is 20-20 but since these oil lines sit so close to the headers, it is wise to use steel braded lines with the highest quality hoses you can purchase.
James

[glenn cooper]

Man that sucks...
Is the hose labeled Oil Resistant?
My RFR came w/ kind of a baby blue hose, Gates I believe? Listed as up to 150 psi and intended for usage w/ oil.
Right side on GSXR is oil out to cooler, but can't see that as having caused anything...

[James Michael]

The hose doesn't have a label but I used it in 2008, 2009 and 2013 so I think it was ok for oil. It's black hose and I told the people who built it that I was using it for oil so I believe that was ok. I think it just wasn't as durable of some of the higher quality hose.
The line on the right side goes to the bottom of the oil cooler so if you're right, then I'm pumping oil up thru to the top of the cooler instead of oil flowing down thru it? This was the way I was told to set it up.
This obviously is no fun for me but maybe someone will avoid having to deal with situation in the future.
James

[James Michael]

On that line, yes it was the line coming from right side of engine to bottom of cooler. Oil is pumped up thru cooler to top of oil cooler then to left side of engine. It looks like the line came apart on the top side of the line just a few inches from engine outlet. I thought this was far enough away from headers not to get affected; possibly over time with exposure to the heat it started to break down. Next time I'll use the highest quality hose I can find, with steel brading then put insulation over the top of that as well.
James

[ghickman]

James
If you have a local supplier for Earl's hoses they normally can make the hoses up for you and pressure test them.

If you aren't fimiliar with installing hose ends on steel braided hose I recommend you pay someone to make them up that has experience doing this. I've seen my share of improperly installed hose ends.

[Brett Lane]

James
If you have a local supplier for Earl's hoses they normally can make the hoses up for you and pressure test them.

If you aren't fimiliar with installing hose ends on steel braided hose I recommend you pay someone to make them up that has experience doing this. I've seen my share of improperly installed hose ends.

There is an Aeroquip dealer close to me, and I had all my oil and fuel lines assembled by them. You buy the hose and fittings, they fabricate them for free.

[Mike Devins]

Found 2 new ways to possibly DNF/DNS this weekend.

#1 master switch had a plastic tab instead of a metal roll pin that had become worn - replaced it on the false grid.

#2 one of the (3) screws that holds the stator to the stator cover backed out - this one was found during engine warmup due to a loud screeching noise, sounded like a slipping belt, found and repaired in about 25 minutes - driver had a spare in the trailer. 07/08 GSXR 1000

[glenn cooper]

#2 above can lead to damned near DNF'ing a Runoffs race while in the lead... I said "damned near"!

My Sunday DNF @ WGI was found to be an inferior grade of spiral wrap insulation on the hot lead for the electric water pump. The stuff shrunk up from engine heat, exposing the water pump hot lead to the (quite sharp) edge of the ZX10 crankcase top vent/access plate, allowing the thing to short out and blow the fuse.

When this car takes to the track next, the wiring will be run through a heat sleeve and zip tied away from the cover, which will also be smoothed out...

[Christopher Crowe]

Thanks to all.

Chris

[JakeL]

-think about installing a water pressure sensor in your data. If you loose a hose or radiator, a warning light will let u know before the engine goes nuclear.

On this topic, I spoke with Ellen at Veracity, since I was going to install a normal pressure sensor in my swirl pot.

She suggested:

A 10 bar solid state pressure sensor like you're using for oil and fuel pressure will do the job, but a lower cost alternative would be this $18.99 low pressure switch from Pegasus: https://www.pegasusautoracing.com/pr...asp?RecID=9749 . In order to connect it to your EVO4 you'll also need a $22.00 AIM VDO pigtail and a $39.00 patch cable. The red lead of the pigtail attaches to the terminal on the switch while the black lead could be cut off as the AIM system supplies a ground. Configure the channel as a 0-5V sensor and set the alarm to trigger below 2V. Much Cheaper.

-Jake

[Revs2-12k]

This product should never replace a thorough "Nut & Bolt" of your Engine Installation (and other critical chassis fasteners for that matter). However, I'm a big fan of Torque-Seal Inspection Lacquer.

Available via Pegasus.
https://www.pegasusautoracing.com/pr...asp?RecID=3165

[brownslane]

This product should never replace a thorough "Nut & Bolt" of your Engine Installation (and other critical chassis fasteners for that matter). However, I'm a big fan of Torque-Seal Inspection Lacquer.

Available via Pegasus.
https://www.pegasusautoracing.com/pr...asp?RecID=3165

I use nail polish from the dollar store. Cheaper and in cooler colours!.

[formulasuper]

would apply to ANY racecar, regardless of engine: safety wiring drains and fills, ensuring tightness, priming oil systems. I really don't see it as a "these cars" type deal, rather a "racecar" deal...

Many of the folks commenting on here are running races quite often; my log book is almost filled up on the RFR, so the odds would point to the fact that JR, myself and some of the others who run quite a bit will see stuff that others might not.

Dan, I hear ya on the "jumping around" thing, as I am super "guilty" of this, but sometimes you have to do that, especially working solo.

Totally agree here. Another thing that can cause a problem is being distracted while working on the car at the track when someone walks up & starts talking. That has caused me more than one DNF over the years.

[racerdad2]

A written checklist is most helpful, especially for the easily distracted like me. The key is to remember to check the checklist

[glenn cooper]

Something to consider when using the popular SAMCO blue silicone hoses for cooling systems: The stock little wimpy Suzuki/Kawi clamps are just fine for the fairly soft rubber hoses on the motorcycle, but the silicone hoses are a bunch harder, and need more clamping force.
My buddy JP purchased the Factory 48 P1 car at Laguna right after the Runoffs, and I looked it over real good. These style clamps were used everywhere.

The clamp shown is a 2"-2.25" ID, but they come sized for even the smaller 1" ID hoses also.

[Skelly]

These clamps pictured do work very well Glen. I have used these for many years on my FM, FE, and FC car with great success. They are stainless steel and very durable. They only thing to consider is to change the regular nylock at the end with a jet nut. In hot areas the nylock will melt causing it to become a little loose.

Sean

[ghickman]

Commonly known as a "T" Bolt clamp. Maybe overkill as a hose clamp but knowing Lee Alexander he was pretty picky about what went into his cars...my guess is they had a hose clamp fail on them and went into full lock down mode.

[RussMcB]

5) In case you do blow an engine make sure you have a really good scatter blanket in front of the engine. Make sure it fits tightly to the engine so that oil can't spray all over the headers. If you have a sloppy installation and you throw a rod it will turn into a nasty fire.

Where is a good source for these? Or, are people making them themselves?

Summit has engine and transmission blankets, but the dimensions aren't great.

Thank you.

[lowside67]

Richard at Rilltech sells them.

-Mark