Van Dieman vs. Reynard

[Rob]

Ok, my ITA car is gone as of yesterday. (*sniff*, I'll miss it, my first 'race car') But, that means I can pursue an FC seriously now. Based on the classifieds on this site and a few at ffunderground, I'm looking at early to mid 90s VDs, most of which have updated bodywork to '95. The Reynards are a bit older - the one ad here for a '90 is a really tempting package. As CFC isn't run near me, I'm looking for a generally decent Regional level package. I want to keep things like parts availability, help available, etc. as considerations too. Way more VDs available - I don't know if that's good or bad. I do want to plan on running this car for at least 3 years, so longevity of the setup is somewhat important. And I must admit, I like the VDs better aesthetically, but the deal ont he Reynard is almost too good to pass up.

What is the consensus here?

- rob

[butchcfc01]

Rob,seems both chassis are great!The Reynard is as quick (1988-1990)v.s.1995 ish Van D's.However,the Reynard seems to require more TLC,
in all areas to be very fast.All chassis are forgiving till they'r fastly set up.I chose the Reynard due to my petite size,6'2"@200lbs.
Both are great cars,but I wouldn't trade mine for a v.d.if I could fit now.Seems the info highway
to set-up is in favor of the v.d.,because of soo manny running.......Hope it Helps!
butchcfc01

[mikeep]

Car choice for a regional is an interesting challenge. You can buy early to mid 90's Van Diemens and late 80's to early 90's Reynards which are pretty equivelent based upon what I have seen at Waterford Hills. The drivers skill is a bigger variable than the chassis choices you are considering.

Probably the most important selection criteria is the cars condition, level of development, and the drive train condition. The issue is you can spend 15K for a early 90's VD that is junk or used up and end up with 20K+ making the car right. You can also buy a 10K Reynard which will need a bunch of money to be developed. Either way set a budget max for the car and buy the best car you can buy with the dollars and then expect to spend $2-3K for rod ends, plumbing and misc issues for what ever car you buy.

You should also consider how hard the car is to set up - It is my understanding that the early 90's VD's are a challenge to set up which may be a consideration. Parts are readily available for both brands which is important. If you want good facts on Reynards, contact Keith Averill of Averill Racing Stuff (see Links). He can steer you right on what to look for in a Reynard as well as VD and also what to avoid.

My race partner and I purchased an 86 Crossle 63F FC and we have had an entertaining time developing the car. We have been able to get a lot of speed by actively developing the car. We can run competitively at Waterford Hills which is a twisty technical track that rewards handling over HP. We have developed the cars shocks, springs, undertrays, front and rear wings, suspension settings, ride heights, rake, tire pressures, track width, and a bunch of other small things. We also had the engine rebuilt by Ivy which made for a dynomite motor. Net, we are about 3-4 seconds a lap faster over the last three years. Our view is that there is much more in this car - we just have to work at getting it. To get the most out of your choice, you are going to have to work at the car. Just buying a VD won't by itself make you fast

Good Luck in your search

David Keep
WHRRI FC #63

[Douglas Kniffin]

Hey Rob, I know this is a bit of a sales pitch but, I've raced both an 88 Reynard and my 94 Van Diemen which I'm currently selling and you can't compare the two. The 94 is vastly more sophisticated and faster. If this was two years ago, I'd say the Reynard is cheap enough that it was worth buying to save the dollars but, the prices for the cars have plumeted to the point that it isn't worth it. With the 94 you have the depth to race nationals or regionals. I ran consistantly in the top 10 here in the Northeast with the car. The other factor is spares and parts. If you buy the reynard, you will be lucky to find another one at the track when you are racing but, there will be 5 94/95 VD's. When you damage the car and need a part you will be on an island with the Reynard instead of having other people to look to for help....trust me...i've been there! It isn't fun.

Doug

[Chas Shaffer]

Rob,
You can debate the virtues of pre 95 VD's vs. post 87 Reynard's all day but in the end if equally prepared they are both very competitive against each other and will cost roughly the same to race. Neither compares in price or competitiveness to the newer cars. Parts, setup knowledge, etc. are readily available for both. You should focus on how much you want to spend and buy the most car for the dollar. Log books, racing history, ownership/maintenance and spares are all important. Log books usually tell you if the car was hit hard (only in SCCA club racing, some pro cars have been crashed hard with no record), racing history can tell you how well the car is sorted out, who owned or maintained the car is a great indicator of car condition and spares are an expensive but necessary evil.

Keep in mind buying a car from a top pro team does not guarantee a good car. Often times they are getting rid of worn out cars which will cost you dearly or you don't get what they raced. Ask if you are getting the shocks, suspension and brake systems they raced and ask for setup sheets. If buying from a private owner look for maintenance records such as gearbox rebuilds by Taylor or J&J, setup or engineering by Stimola, Cole, Leslie, ICP or others in the business and engine rebuilds by Quicksilver, Elite, Ivey, Dixon or Justice. I'd stay away from home gearbox or engine rebuilds unless you can be sure they know what they are doing.

[BrooksHall]

I agree about cost of running and the home rebuilds. The reason I bought an older car was becuase the buy in was in my budget. I knew the motor was a home built unit and I bugdeted money to have it rebuilt. I started looking in April which is probably the worst time to look as most cars are being raced at that time of the year. Basically for the low end price of a 95 VD I have a completely fresh 89 Bobby Carville/Averill Reynard with a boat load of spares ($14.3k). I also only want to run regionals which is something else to consider. This car is a good "regional only" car so it was the right car for my needs. We now have CFC in Cal Club but if the class should go away I can still have fun on a regional level.