Wanted - Zink 10 suspension parts

[RMVR53]

working on a very early Z10 and can go in several directions but I want to keep it vintage legal. I need a 10c left rear upright....OR I need both rear uprights for a 10a and can use as possible partial trade right side front arm and rear upright (inboard brake style).

anybody got anything?

Bill F
Rmvr53@aol.com

[Stan Clayton]

Hi Bill,

Welcome to the Zink fraternity (if you are not an old hand)!

Do you really have a 10A? I understand there were only 3 made. I have one of about 10 10Bs...but Steve Lathrop can set us straight.

And BTW, have you contacted Steve? He is busy with his new FC-Zetec and F-1000 projects these days, but may have some Z10C parts on the shelf. If not in contact with him, be sure to ring him up on 317.273.0089. Their website is http://icpcitation.com/index.htm.

Cheers! Stan

[S Lathrop]

There are 2 types of Z10 rear uprights, Z10A and Z10C.

There are 2 variations for the Z10A rear uprights; The original which used the original VW bearing setup (an outer roller bearing with a ball inner bearing) and a later version which used 2 ball bearing setup. The Z9 SFV used drum rear brakes. The original Z10 and Z11 used the remaining stock of the Z9 rear uprights. Stan is right about there not being many cars with the original Z9 type rear uprights, but the number is more like 10 cars.

The bearing arrangement was unchanged from the Z10A and Z10C but the construction of the upright changed a lot. After Citation Engineering started making all the uprights, The construction for the Z10A and Z10C were the same but the pickup locations were different.

The Z10C upright is easy to identify because it has a pickup for the shock on the upright. The Z10A upright has the shock attached to the lower rear a-arm. The Z10C also has a clevis on the upper portion of the upright for the rear trailing arm. The Z10A has the rear upper training link attached to a clevis which is in common with the rear camber link.

About half of all the cars that were converted to Z10C were changed at the front only. There were no cars originally built as Z10Cs.

The Z10B was produced one year and consisted of a change to the front and rear suspension pickups on the chassis.

As we developed the Z16, we decided to introduce an update kit for the Z10A. That was the Z10C. It was designed to fit only the Z10A chassis. Over the years we converted most of the Z10Bs to Z10A pickups and installed the Z10C conversions.

That is the story.

[RMVR53]

oh its an early 10A alright. I do still have the 10a uprights but they are now on a Zink Sports Racer. When I was looking for rear uprights for the Z-4, Ed Zink told me to find an old Z-10 and get the uprights for it - they were for the most part a fabricated version of the castings made for the early cars he said. I couldn't find just a pair of uprights at the time but I found a whole car which was wrecked so I bought it. Move 15 years later and now an old scrap FFord is "vintage eligible" so Im going to rebuild it since I never got rid of anything (and neither did the PO).

The car is ex Bob Scoggens out of Dallas which has been updated to 10c specs but all the suspension pickup points appear to be there for both versions. Hence for "Vintage" purposes, I am going back to 10a on the front and just use 10c rear uprights since I have both front 10a arms. Unless someone wants the 10c right arm/rear upright for a pair of 10a rears or I find a pair of 10a rears quite reasonable.
It also has the early moveable pedal assy which in a conversation some years ago with you Steve (if I remember correctly) you said was only on the first 3 or 4 cars?

The car is for sale locally but if it doesn't sell it will continue to be in holding for a future rebuild hence why Im gathering the necessary parts

Bill

[GeoffRain]

Steve,

Which direction did the inbord front lower chassis pickup move with the C conversion?

Geoff

[S Lathrop]

Steve,

Which direction did the inbord front lower chassis pickup move with the C conversion?

Geoff

It did not really move. The Z10C rocker has the inboard protion of the rocker offset to the front of the car. This was done so we could retain the same motion ratio even though the outboard end is longer. The lower clevis was wide enough for the shock and the front transverse link to fit inside the clevis.

On the early cars, Z10A, we raised the front lower trailing link pickup at the rear to add some anti dive. That is why there are 2 pickups on the early Z10. Later cars were built with the higher pickup only. I now advise people to put the pickup in the original lower location to get rid of the anti dive. Anti dive agrivates a car's tendency to understeer.

[Stan Clayton]

The Z10C upright is easy to identify because it has a pickup for the shock on the upright. The Z10A upright has the shock attached to the lower rear a-arm. The Z10C also has a clevis on the upper portion of the upright for the rear trailing arm. The Z10A has the rear upper training link attached to a clevis which is in common with the rear camber link.

My cars fits Steve's description for a Z10A in both regards.

The Z10B was produced one year and consisted of a change to the front and rear suspension pickups on the chassis.

The original logbook with my car identifies it as a 1975 Z10B. Did you build that car, Steve, or were the B models still built by Ed?

Thanks! Stan

[Eric Cruz]

Hi Steve,
While you are answering all the questions about proper nomenclature of the Z-10s, you may remember my previous car was one of (two total, maybe?) the cars with the fabricated front uprights that take the LD-19s. You mentioned something about building it after a week long drunk, and I'd better never crash it bad enough to need those uprights...

Did those cars have a designation? Z-10A(bortion), maybe?

Best regards,
Eric

[J.D. King]

I have a rear upright that has the caliper mounting tab welded to if for an LD-19 outboard brake setup. I believe that chassis it came from was the two hole position rear trailing link setup.

My current racer is a narrow track front end with the one (upper) rear trailing arm hole. I suppose it makes mine a "B", it is a 1976 chassis.

[S Lathrop]

My cars fits Steve's description for a Z10A in both regards.

The original logbook with my car identifies it as a 1975 Z10B. Did you build that car, Steve, or were the B models still built by Ed?

Thanks! Stan

All of the steel parts were built in Charlotte, NC. They were shipped to Indy where every thing else was added. We did the plating and finishing of the kits and cars. I contracted the fiberglass as well. Starting with the Z16, all production was in Indy. At one time, I think we manufactured more parts on my cars than any other FF manufacturer.

[S Lathrop]

Hi Steve,
While you are answering all the questions about proper nomenclature of the Z-10s, you may remember my previous car was one of (two total, maybe?) the cars with the fabricated front uprights that take the LD-19s. You mentioned something about building it after a week long drunk, and I'd better never crash it bad enough to need those uprights...

Did those cars have a designation? Z-10A(bortion), maybe?

Best regards,
Eric

That was for the Z10 suspension. It was because of that experience (the fabricated front uprights) that Ed and I choose to use VW dasher as the basis for the Z16 instead of the Rabit as David Bruns did on the Swift.

We broke a few front spindles working out the design. Citations and Zinks have never broken spindles with the exception of the first few Z10 experiments.

[GeoffRain]

Are these the uprights you're talking about?

[RMVR53]

Are these the uprights you're talking about?

look nothing like my 10a or the one 10c that I have

Bill

[Stan Clayton]

Nothing like mine, either. My Z10 has VW Type 3 front corners and sheet metal rears (with inboard brakes).

Thanks for the added history, Steve!

Stan

[S Lathrop]

Those are the ones.

I don't think there were more than 2 to 3 sets made. The spindle was the third attempt.

[Stan Clayton]

Just to be sure...which car do you refer to, Steve?

[S Lathrop]

I don't rember exactly when I did those uprights. They were for the Z10A, Maybe 76 or 77. Those parts were never standard or really offered for sale. It was an attempt to reduce the weight of the VW front asssembly.

I made a set of front uprights for a Z10 last year. They saved 15 pounds total.

We stopped production in 77. Introduced the Z10C update in 78. I built the first Z16 in 1978.

[jcp]

Steve,
do you know how many 10A's were built ?

[S Lathrop]

We only counted frames. 90 frames total. 80 were 10As

[Eric Cruz]

Sorry, I haven't been paying attention. Yes, Geoff, those are precisely the uprights that were on my old car. Thank you, Steve, for the enlightenment. I think the car I had first came on the scene in '76, so that sounds right.

Geoff, are those uprights attached to anything now? If not, I know someone that might be interested in purchasing them. They look to be in better shape than the ones I sold him on the car.....

Best regards,
Eric

p.s. I think this was a thread about Bill wanting to get some Z-10 parts. Was this discussion helpful to you, Bill?

[RMVR53]

p.s. I think this was a thread about Bill wanting to get some Z-10 parts. Was this discussion helpful to you, Bill?

the info has been helpful...but I still need the parts!!

Bill

[GeoffRain]

I'd be willing to sell the uprights for a reasonable price. I'll send you my email.

Geoff

[RMVR53]

Thanks Geoff

but we are talking about rears and not the ones in your posted pics?

Bill

[GeoffRain]

Sorry, I was responding to Eric. I won't hijack your thread any further

[RMVR53]

Darn...I thought I'd gotten lucky....

Bill

[Bob Ramberg]

Steve - any plans to produce more of the lightweight uprights? Any pictures?

[RMVR53]

still need the parts....anyone got anything?

anyone know how to get ahold of Larry Oliver to see if he has anything?

Bill

[DanW]

Bill,

Larry Oliver at International Racing Products:

http://www.formulacars.com/

Call IRP at 703-759-0567 (Tech Line) or or 800-793-0496 (Order Line) or email us!

Good luck finding what you need.

Regards,
Dan Wise

[RMVR53]

thank you thank you thank you!!!

[S Lathrop]

Steve - any plans to produce more of the lightweight uprights? Any pictures?

I can run some when we do the uprights for the new cars. The uprights are machined from the same blank. There are a lot of options for spindles, rotors and calipers. Best e-mail me.

Actual cost is yet to be determined. The first set were strictly proto types and cost way more than they sold for.

The proto types were done with VW spindle and rotors (Z16 style) and LD19 claipers. They saved close to 20 lbs over the type 3 VW setup.

[normv]

[SIZE=3][FONT=Times New Roman]I am after the distance between the upper and lower holes on the rear of the front lower training arm link (at the front of the seat) as Steve referred to above, as I would like to try to reduce the understeer my Z10 has and my car has been modified at the front and only has the upper one now, also the front part of the lower arm isn’t not connected to the lower shock mount anymore but is further forward and inboard of this.[/FONT][/SIZE]
[SIZE=3][FONT=Times New Roman] Thanks Norm[/FONT][/SIZE]

[Larry]

Working from memory, I have in inventory:
Front rockers
One front upright
Front radius rods/lateral links
Rear radius rods/lateral link
One rear wishbone
One new ATE brake caliper
Two used ATE caliper
Two rear brake rotors

NEW upper body section

I'm sure there's more that I can't think of.
Call for prices at 703-759-0567. With the switch to toll-free cellular, I've disconnected my 800-number due to lack of use. I'm still available most evenings until 9:00 PM eastern

Larry Oliver
International Racing Products