Battery vs. Cable For Winch

[Tom Sprecher]

I want to put a winch in my trailer to help in loading my car. Somehow, even with what I thought was extreme patience, an understanding tone of voice and my overall easy going nature, my wife will no longer help guide me into the trailer or give me a moan-back. Plus, it’s a tin top and once in the trailer it is so tight that getting out of the car is quite a trick in contortionism.

It looks like the cost to run 2 ga cables w/disconnects from the F-250 batteries to the winch or buy a battery the same size w/mounting box that will reside on the trailer is a wash.

You guys have any opinions or suggestions?

[rickjohnson356]

Get the extra battery and put it in the trailer or outside on the tongue. Hook up the extra hot common on the 7-way plug to charge the battery while towing to/from.

based on my experience with the GN and 12v 3500 lb winch I used to have, the extra battery is good for 1 or 2 pulls loading in the the trailer before it is drained.

I would not want to risk draining the truck battery and not getting it started to be able to go home after a weekend.

================================================== =====
Alternatively, get an open trailer. Tin-tops dont need to be covered up anyway

[gord leach]

You guys have any opinions or suggestions?

TinTop???..........well the first thing you need is a SawzAll.
1.loose the roof
2.loose those "pesky" fenders (darn things always in the way)
3.Waalaa it's lighter (easy to load by yourself)
4.don't have anything "cloaking" the tires,hence easy to walk around

problem solved, your welcome LOL

sorry it's friday.........long week.......need beer.......never understood sedan racing

best of luck

gord(snow please go away)leach

[Roger Eade]

Useing the spare wire on the trailer plug to charge up the battery on the trailer, put a bocking diode in place, this will ensure that you will not cook your wiring loom if the truck battery gets down, and you are trying to pull 200 amps though that little bit of wre!
Apart from that, get rid of it and buy a real car!
Roger

PS you could, if you could afford it, get a new pit pixie, she would be good for a couple of years before you had to get another one.

[Daryl DeArman]

A battery in the trailer...less drain on the trucks' batteries and charging system. Less work, less stuff to lug around.

Get a deep cycle...if the battery will be draining very low and sit for a time between uses it is likely to last longer than a 'regular' battery.

And who cares about the tin-top? A race car is a race car, they ALL have limitations and we o our best to work around them. That challenge is half the fun...but then I have had karts, open wheel, tintop, tintop, tintop, open wheel, open wheel and now a tin top again.

[RussMcB]

Mount a battery in/on the trailer. You will find it extremely handy for the trailer to always have power even if there isn't a tow vehicle connected to it.

I've also found my winch with key fob remote button very handy. I can easily load the car myself, steering it in with one hand while mashing* the button with the other.

Russ

* Mashing - it's a southern thang.

[Garey Guzman]

Tom,
First of all, you need to get an open wheel car. Not only are they easier to load, the chicks dig them! My wife doesn't mind watching me load and telling me which way to push!

We kid you because we care.

Seriously, get a big battery for the trailer only, and wire to charge from the truck as suggested. If Rick's is dying after only a pull or two, get a big, deep cycle or maybe two batteries! My F350 has the dual battery option and it's really difficult to wear it down.

Daryl,
You tin-top sympathizer! Come back from the dark side....

[GT1Vette]

We had a deep charge battery on the big trailer that ran the winch, sound system in the crew lounge, and 12v interior lights in the trailer. With a full charge it would last multiple weekends even hauling a 3000 pound car into the trailer - as long as no one left the interior lights or the sound system on. We ended up putting a master cut-off switch in the circuit right up by the battery and had no more problems. I'm planning to do a similar system in the new small(er) 28' trailer, except no sound system to worry about.

[Tom Sprecher]

Thanks for all the advice guys and this still proves to be the best place to get it.

I'll have to keep the pit pixie of the last twenty years. Recently, I thought if there was anything I had that was worth losing everything else to keep and my only answer was her.

The F-250 has duel batteries but the idea of loading everything up and then not having the truck start due to weak batteries is weak.

I found me a winch with a button I can mash to put the car up cuz there ain't no way in hell I'm a gonna be showed up by some damn Yankee named Russ.

Some of my best friends drive Formula cars and I did think about getting an open wheel car. After hanging out with those guys for a several years I decided against it after finding that some, but no one I know personally, can really come across as egotistical snobs who dream that most hot chicks really don't like NASCAR.

What size deep cycle am I looking for? Where can I get that diode?

Thanks again,

[Brian]

http://www.hellroaring.com/

For example. They have progressed beyond a simple diode. Also, I use the same battery to power my winch as I use for jump starting the race car, with the same plug. A winch really doesn't take much, any medium sized marine/RV type battery will do. Get one with a strap if you are going to use it as a jump battery too.

Brian

[DanW]

I have had really good luck with the Costco/Kirkland batteries. They have a marine-deep cycle duty battery rated at 750 amps for about $72. We used them on the workboats in my old job at the refinery. They withstood a lot of abuse, with no failures.

[Peter Horvath]

* Mashing - it's a southern thang.

I always like it when they're mashing sweet potatoes, whenever we go south. It's difficult to find well-prepared sweet potatoes in Ohio.
Our longest race weekend was four days, at MidOhio with F2000. The battery and winch got the car in and out of the trailer four times, no problem. We use it for lights too.
We have a separate battery to start the racecar.
There's not much reason to connect the battery to the car charger. The only time it would be charging the battery is on the way home.

[Daryl DeArman]

Just because I was tin-top sympathetic, don't lump me in with the NASCAR supporters.

I will probably have another open wheel car, I was looking for a Vintage Super Vee, but couldn't find what I wanted. I am sure I'll get bored with the current car as soon as it is sorted and I win a few (that will be awhile with this one).

[R John Lye]

I'll agree with Russ here - a previous winch had a wired remote, but
I replaced it a with a key fob type wireless and that makes it much
easier to load up. I used to run over the wire all too often, and that's
no fun. I can't do that with wireless, obviously, so its one less thing
to have to think about at the end of the weekend.

John

[Garey Guzman]

Is the wireless button something you can get seperately or do you have to get the winch with the wireless control?

[Rick Iverson]

Tom;

Save the expense. Married? I sit in the car and steer while "She who must be obeyed" pushes. Sound about right to you?

Iverson

[Hawke]

I'm having a new trailer built, and have specified the same battery to run the winch as in the Formula Ford. Thought it would be good to have a spare. All it will do is run the winch, and will be charged from the car when attached.

Thoughts?

[R John Lye]

Is the wireless button something you can get seperately or do you have to get the winch with the wireless control?

Depending on the winch manufacturer, you may be able to get a
wireless remote kit for an already installed winch. Superwinch,
for one, offers an upgrade kit. I think that Ramsey and some
of the others might as well. Check out Summit Racing and places
like that for the kits.

Hope that helps,
John

[Blacksport350]

I just went through this process and decided on a Superwinch S4000 as the best winch I could find that also had good speed so I wouldn't have to wait 5 minutes for the car to load. Also went with a deep cycle battery to run the winch and 12volt lights inside the trailer when the truck isn't hooked up. While I was at it, I figured I might as well be totally lazy and get an electric tongue jack so I had that tied into the battery. For those of us that have to lift the front of the trailer to get the trailer on the truck, lock it, lift the tongue with the back of the truck to get the load levelers on, then drive to get the car and lift it again to get a shallow angle on the ramp, etc, I think the electric jack will be better than the winch at the end of the day!

One thing to consider with battery location is that while tongue mounting it won't take up any storage room, putting it inside the trailer would allow you to rn a trailer alarm system if you wanted to at some point.

[Becker Motorsports]

We mounted a battery in our trailer to power the whinch and installed a solar panal on the roof to keep it charged. the solar panal is aprox. 10"x18" and has worked perfectly for the past 6 yearsand was not all that expensive [$100]. WE found it at a RV trailer store, apparently they have been using them for years.

Regards ernie

PS. the solar panal automatically goes into maintenance mode when the battery is fully charged. We also have another solar panel which we use to chage the race car battery between sessions, without having to remove it. works perfectly!

[Blacksport350]

I'm having a new trailer built, and have specified the same battery to run the winch as in the Formula Ford. Thought it would be good to have a spare. All it will do is run the winch, and will be charged from the car when attached.

Thoughts?

That is a reasonable idea but I personally would want a bigger battery as many winches can pull just over 100 amps. This could lead to the early demise of an expensive battery.

[SSpiffytoo]

It looks like the cost to run 2 ga cables w/disconnects from the F-250 batteries to the winch or buy a battery the same size w/mounting box that will reside on the trailer is a wash.

You guys have any opinions or suggestions?

Yeah, assuming a 100 amp load and 25 feet (one way) of cable, 2 ga isn't big enough. To get below 5% voltage drop, you need at least 2/0. Even 4/0 won't get it down where you really want it (<2% drop.)

Battery on the trailer FTW.

[Tom Sprecher]

I'm going with the battery in the trailer. I've just ordered a 3000# remote controlled winch from HF for $69. A marine battery from O'Reilly's is $45 and the case is $9. No longer needing to involve my wife: priceless.

[RussMcB]

I've just ordered a 3000# remote controlled winch from HF for $69.

Wow. I thought I got a good deal after shopping around ($250?). Let us know how that works out. $69 is nothing in race car dollars. :-).

[Garey Guzman]

Wow. I thought I got a good deal after shopping around ($250?). Let us know how that works out.....

I could be wrong but I believe that the difference is in the type of winch. It's a lot easier to pull 3000# than to lift 3000#. I'm guessing that Tom got the one rated for pulling and Russ got the one rated for lifting.

Something I forgot to mention earlier - my old 24' trailer could carry two cars with a ramp. The front was attached to the trailer, the car rolled onto the ramp, the back of the car was tied to the back of the ramp and then my winch lifted the back of the ramp up ~4' via a pully in the roof. The second car would go in with about 1/2 of it under the first car.

Anyway, a properly attached roof pully allows me to lift the whole car in the air via the roll hoop!

.... $69 is nothing in race car dollars. :-).

Isn't that a fact!

[jsm]

I just installed a remote winch from HF in my toyhauler. It works great on my FE. I use a spare battery to power it and I charge it after a few uses. I installed it so that I can remove the winch and store it when I'm not using it. ( less stubbed toes in the middle of the night and looks alot better, out of the way.) Now that I have it, I ( and my son) wouldn't want to load it without it!

[rjnicholas]

I used to charge the battery in the trailer from the main battery. I even installed a battery isolator so that it could not drain the starting battery. Then I let the battery in the trailer run down to low. When I started the truck, it drew so much current trying to recharge that it overheated the isolator and burned up the wire going to the harness, so I have since disconnected that.

I use a very small winch that I bought from harbor freight for fifty bucks on sale. It has plenty of power to pull my car up the ramp, and the battery never runs down in normal use. I just recharge it when I am recharging the car battery. It has lasted a long time.

Also, because the winch uses a very thin cable, it is fifty feet long and much easier to handle than a stronger winch. I recommend it.

[Mike Allison]

Here's a website that I can personally recommend. http://www.tommyjohnsonjr.com/wireless.htm
Tommy is the father of Tommy Johnson, Jr. NHRA Funny Car driver and father-in-law to Melanie Troxel, former Top Fuel, now Funny Car driver. A pretty fast family.

Tommy can retro fit winches with his remotes.

mike

[Tom Sprecher]

My back ordered $69 winch that is and I would guess the price difference is based on it's origin as well.

[bob darcey]

jsm said: I just installed a remote winch from HF in my toyhauler.

HF has a Item No. 95912-2VGA with wireless remote. The specs say 6 FPM at 3000 lbs load. Is this the unit you installed? 6 FPM seems really slow, but does it speed up for lesser loads? This is very inexpensive considering the wireless remote. Any thoughts?

[jsm]

Bob,
It isn't The fastest thing in town. But, When I am loading alone thats fine with me. If something were to go wrong I can make adjustments to my ramps w/o stopping. I never have to back it up to realign either. When its pulling up the the steep part of the ramp it goes 6 ft/min. when she's just rolling along it does seem to go faster. I'm just glad its not myself having to expend the energy to push/pull her up. Or get run over if she gets away from me.(let alone the damage to the car, garage, trailer, ego.) for $69 its worth it!

[bob darcey]

Thanks. For that price, it's worth a shot. The wireless remote will be handy.

[Blacksport350]

jsm said: I just installed a remote winch from HF in my toyhauler.

HF has a Item No. 95912-2VGA with wireless remote. The specs say 6 FPM at 3000 lbs load. Is this the unit you installed? 6 FPM seems really slow, but does it speed up for lesser loads? This is very inexpensive considering the wireless remote. Any thoughts?

They do seem to speed up a bit with a lesser load but not too much. I run a Superwinch S4000 that is about 25FPM and that loads at a perfect speed pulling in 1100lbs up the incline of the trailer. Basically, it takes a minute to pull the car all the way in which really isn't very fast when you think about it. I was worried that it would be too fast but that hasn't been a problem yet. The 6 FPM will work fine, you will just have to sip a beer while you are loading.

[Tom Sprecher]

jsm said: I just installed a remote winch from HF in my toyhauler.

HF has a Item No. 95912-2VGA with wireless remote. The specs say 6 FPM at 3000 lbs load. Is this the unit you installed? 6 FPM seems really slow, but does it speed up for lesser loads? This is very inexpensive considering the wireless remote. Any thoughts?

Or at least mine is. If it is slow I'll help push with one hand while drinking a beer with the other.

[bob darcey]

Line speed info from HF customer service on the 95912 winch:

no load: 7.2 FPM
1000 lb: 5.7 FPM
2000 lb: 4.8 FPM
3000 lb: 4.3 FPM

According to the cs rep, the "6 FPM @ 3000 lb" claim on the web site is incorrect, probably more like 6 FPM @ 500 lbs. At 7 FPM, 30 ft. of travel will be ~4 to 4.5 minutes.