The New IndyCar?

[Jim Gustafson]

Pictures of the proposed Dallara at www.indycar.com

Jim Gustafson
Visual Communications

[Matt King]

It looks like a HOT WHEELS car, but it's WAY better looking than the current cars.

[rickb99]

LOL, looks like Indy car technology is finally catching up to F1000

Looks like a Phoenix for a Stohr to me

[greg pizzo]

They (indy car) finally start gaining some traction and respect ... then move to a CARTOON CHARACTER car !! ?????

the A1GP (old car) was pretty fugly but better than these cartoons ........ what about the NEW A1GP (Ferarri) car or the last incarnation of the CART car ... maybe not 100% SAFE as these CARTOONS but atleast you dont have to turn your head when they come into sight.....
hopefully SOMEONE at Dallara will wake up and make a real car before these cartoons are made into real moulds !!!

[Dennis Valet]

Fail

[Keith Carter]

It looks like a HOT WHEELS car, but it's WAY better looking than the current cars.

That description hit the nail on the head. The Hot Wheels formula cars look just like this!

The IRL presents the "Hotwheels Nitro Scorcher" IZOD Series.

[jim morgan]

Hey I liked Hot Wheels, and they were a whole lot cheaper to keep junior happy. Rather than Fail I think Flail is a better description.

[D.T. Benner]

"More Space for Sponsor Logo's" sounds like NA----R Envy to me Maybe they need to ad GIANT top wings like WOO?

[HazelNut]

the maroon and orange one aren't terrible but the red one is ridiculous.

[Jim Nash]

I like the red one. It reminds me of the Gurney Eagle with the stock block engine of the late 70's, early 80's. But even without the historic reference, I think it looks good

Jim Nash

[Stan Clayton]

Contrary to my expectations, that actually turned out to be an interesting article...artist's renditions aside!

I find it interesting that IRL published the list of their 8 design objectives, as well as the list of companies competing for the contract. Publicly talking with Dallara Automobili, DeltaWing, Lola and Swift really puts the pressure on each company to sharpen their cost control pencils and tells them that this time there will be no simply handing the contract to so-and-so.

Here's my spin on those 8 design objectives:

Safe: The new chassis must adhere to the league's already high safety standards while exploring new technology to improve safety in all aspects of the car.

This is easy. DeltaWing aside, the others have all recently homologated cars to F1 safety standards, so this is a no-brainer. The North American lab certified to do FIA testing is in Indy.

Raceable: The new chassis must continue to produce the exciting racing that has become signature of the IZOD IndyCar Series while not affecting other cars on track (i.e. less sensitive to the turbulence).

Another no-brainer...mandate the street course spec parts for all races, irrespective of the venue. Need to slow the cars at the Brickyard? No sweat! If they're running the high-downforce street wings they will go slower! This bunches the cars up at Indy, making for "exciting racing". Duh!

Also, 2012 is the new 1979. In other words, it's the tunnels, stupid! Want cars that can race together, aren't pitch, ride-height and yaw sensitive? Put freaking tunnels under them!

Cost-effective: The league continues to work to reduce the cost of participation for teams in the IZOD IndyCar Series, which remains an important priority in this economic climate. The new chassis must have a price point that adheres to that goal.

Well duh again! Let's see...make the cars in a boutique facility in northern Italy where the unions mandate $80/hr and a 15 minute break after every 15 minutes of "work", or in Indy where offering $20/hr will get you a line stretching around the block of highly skilled and motivated folks who will work 'til they drop?

American-made: The new chassis must be built in the U.S., preferably at an Indiana-based facility.
Less mass/more efficient: A lighter chassis with less mass that produces the same aerodynamic effect in an efficient way.

See cost-effective above, but also note the tax bennies the State of Indiana is offering...

Relevant technology: The league would like the new chassis to be relevant to the future of the consumer auto industry; innovative technology that is born on the racetrack and can translate to consumer cars.

Umm...whatever.

Modern look: More space for sponsor logos, cars easily identifiable.



Green: The Indy Racing League prides itself on its role in the greening of racing and wants to maintain its position as a leader in environmentally-friendly initiatives with this chassis.

I guess this means they'll stick with corn-based ethanol. Whatever.

[greg pizzo]

See its not all that hard ... no need to get all CARTOON on us !!!
nicely put !!!

[VehDyn]

Didn't the DP01 meet most if not all those criteria? It had some bugs, but they were starting to iron those out.

[RussMcB]

Hey, have you guys heard about the "Delta Wing" car in IRL? I may be late to the table, having just heard about it this morning in a Robin Miller article. I Googled for more info and it sounds pretty interesting. No pictures yet, so it's too early (for me) to decide if it's good or bad, but certainly interesting. No wings, light weight, non-stressed 4 cyl inline turbo (so many manufacturers could participate).

http://www.google.com/search?q=IRL+"Delta+Wing"

[D.T. Benner]

I think the term "IRL Death Spiral" is more appropriate.
A series owned by a bunch of Old Ladies,run by an Ex Bull Rider front man using Low Tech goofy spec cars? Makes you wonder if Indy Lites will be more like real Racing? Oh,I guess Indy Lites will have to be dumbed down evel lower so the Big Show won't look so pathetic!

[RussMcB]

<snip> Want cars that can race together, aren't pitch, ride-height and yaw sensitive? Put freaking tunnels under them!

I thought tunnel cars were more sensitive to ride height and pitch, especially after the movable, ground sealing skirts were banned.

I hope they come up with ways to have downforce and drag be less affected by cars ahead. I hate racing where the following car doesn't have enough downforce to try a slingshot pass, or goes backwards if they get out of the long single line of cars.

[Stan Clayton]

I thought tunnel cars were more sensitive to ride height and pitch, especially after the movable, ground sealing skirts were banned.

Compared to skirted tunnel cars, yes, but not compared to flat bottomed cars. You can make a tunnel car fly if you work hard enough at it, but flat bottom cars seem to want to fly.

Flying Porsche

Flying Mercedes

These and other incidents prompted FIA and ACO to ban flat bottoms, and both now require large diffusers on prototypes as well as angling the undertrays upwards at several degrees as they go outboard, resulting in a wing-shape in cross section.

In F1 the FIA started requiring stepped bottoms a number of years ago, with the lower surface of the sidepods 50mm higher than the bottom of the tub.

The problem with true flat bottoms is two-fold. First, maintaining the proper ride height and rake angle (pitch) are critical to maintaining the downforce. Second, get out of that window and you not only lose the downforce in an abrupt manner, but you also present a nice flat surface for the air to grab hold of.

In contrast, a tunnel car loses its downforce comparatively gradually and predictably as its ride height increases. Moreover, our Ralt is insensitive to rake for downforce purposes (rear ride height is still adjusted for over/under steer purposes), and if a bump tosses the front of the car a little ways into the air, it still presents curved undertray surfaces to the airflow that are producing downforce instead of a Porsche-style flat plate it can grab and toss around.

IRL may not be seriously considering reintroducing tunnels, but if they are not, they're being too conservative IMO.

[Purple Frog]

The Swift concepts are now posted on Indycar.com or Racecar-Engineering.com.

Makes a late model F2000 car look sort of 'vintage'.

[Matthew Inge]

the maroon and orange one aren't terrible but the red one is ridiculous.

That is because those are the two best colors.

[Dennis Valet]

That is because those are the two best colors.

Maroon and gold > Maroon and orange

[TrackBrat]

The Delta car is getting its debut at the Chicago Autoshow tomorrow. A lot of big names are going to be there, though it is a concept developed by a number of teams. No matter what is going on, they need multiple engines and chassis, and I think 2012 is too late for them to do this.

We could already have a problem with the cars since it seems they will be 4cylinder turbos....I just hope to god it's an improvement over the current engine note.

I would love for us to just go back to the cars of the 90's with modern safety updates and such. It was fantastic racing, they need to look back and see what worked and throw out what does not work.

[Jim Nash]

I am looking forward to seeing the Delta car. Swift Engineering sure had some interesting concepts posted on their site. How bold will the IRL dare to go?

Jim Nash

[VehDyn]

Hmmmmm. I just don't see this working.

[VehDyn]

Here is an interview with the designer:

http://auto-racing.speedtv.com/artic...-wing-project/

And some simulations:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Cxe_hN5sDw
http://www.youtube.com/user/DeltaWin.../0/rah0RSIEVC8
http://www.youtube.com/user/DeltaWin.../2/OAo0mbCFDAw

[Raceworks]

I don't know about functionality on the Delta Wing, but I see all sorts of sponsorship opportunities: Viagra, Cialis, Oscar Meyer.....

[nulrich]

I see all kinds of issues and and I'm puzzled about some of the statements made by the designers, but they are a smart and experienced team, so I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt and see how it develops.

The best part of the whole announcement, in my opinion, is this:

"Crucially, Bowlby said he does not want the DeltaWing to become a spec chassis for the IndyCar Series, and wants rival chassis builders to be able to enter cars built within the rules framework established by his concept."

I'm pretty sure the IRL won't go away from a spec chassis (too much income would be lost by them and their partners), but that one change might save Indy Car from dying a slow death.

Nathan

[Skylane]

Rear steering;
Attachment 18298
http://auto-racing.speedtv.com/artic...-wing-project/

http://www.racer.com/delta-wing-unve...MC-RACER_DAILY

Attachment 18297

[jcolegrove]

Hmmmmm. I just don't see this working.

It looks like a dick and balls to me. Seriously, these abominations are heinous crimes to race cars and motorsports fans worldwide. Indycar deserves to collapse if they go with any of these designs.

How bout instead of this trash they just buy GP2 cars...

[RussMcB]

• Front track: 24 inches

What's going to happen when it gets to a corner?

It might make for much more interesting racing.

[D.T. Benner]

I'm going to Puke! If this turns out to be the next IRL car the Old Ladies and The Ex Bull Rider Front man will have created another Form of "Entertainment"- that seems to be what they want.
Open wheel racing has always been about Just That-Open Wheels. The big difference between Open Wheel racing and NA---R has been the penalty a driver may pay for doing Stupid S--T to another car. With these things it will be like NA---R with lots of Rubbin and Contact but there will be More Room for sponsors Logos.

[Keith Carter]

Go Speed Racer Go!!!

[Ty_Handke_83]

uhhh, yeah...
If that's what the future holds, I think I'm going to give up open wheel racing and go back to stock cars...
The Dallara and Swift cars don't look that bad, but this???

[Dennis Valet]

At least they weren't kidding when they said it would be the most radical of the proposed designs

[Jim Gustafson]

So far, I like the looks of the Swift.

Jim Gustafson
Visual Communications

[LJennings]

I think he lifted the concept from the car that was pictured on the inside cover of a certain Steppenwolf album.

[Scott Gesford]

Did anyone tell the designer the car needs to turn at the end of the straight? STUPID STUPID

Yeah, the swift looks ok to me.

[PaulT]

What's going to happen when it gets to a corner?

That's what the giant rudder in the back is for!

Paul

[jim morgan]

So now instead of Gasoline Alley we will have the "Bat Cave" bIFF,bOOM pOW

[VehDyn]

From their website. "80% of the downforce is at the rear". Couple this with the fact that the front track is 1/3 of the width of my stohr, I just can't see how it will turn. If you dont have mechanical grip, and no aero grip, where does the grip come from? Am I missing something?

Maybe they are incorporating "lasers" and are using "laser" grip or something new and fancy.

[Mark_Silverberg]

Actually there will be torque vectoring in the rear differential so not all the turning will occur in the front end.

Given the amount of weight on the front end I do not see the front track as a major issue.

I do see the cornering speeds as being lower - this should make for better racing and more passing opportunities.

My only concern is that with a narrow front track some drivers may be very agressive in trying to get a nose under another car.

I think the new car looks great - current formula car shape is not efficient. It is time for a change.