14 Year Olds

[Greg Mercurio]

All: I received some emails from the BOD today, they voted down the 14 YO proposal.

Thanks to all the BOD members that contacted me as well a those who sent their concerns to the BOD.

It does work.

[Steve Demeter]

Got something right. The system really does work.

[Don Jones]

Thank God. Who wants those experienced, competitive, well- funded drivers in SCCA anyway? Now they can go straight to the Skippy program and never give SCCA another thought.

[RussMcB]

I guess the BOD weighed the pros and cons and decided the negatives outweighed the positives. I'm happy with their decision.

[John LaRue]

AARP

I read somewhere that the majority of the membership in SCCA is eligible for their AARP membership as well.

It may be that the club's gravitation towards the sedan market is an attempt to chase the youth market we see in drifting, NOPI and that stuff. While we may all feel better by not having a 14 year old racing against us someone needs to be thinking about how the club is going to bring them in 4 years hence; especially to formula car racing. I don't see it happening.

[Cole Morgan]

I'm interested to see the FC Runoff's field. What the average age is, who all is there.

[Purple Frog]

Cole,
Isn't it past your bedtime?
You need to be testing later today.

[Mark H]

My little man had his first GSKA (kinda like a regional for karts) weekend last Sat!!!!!!!!

I have always worried about and haven't promoted, him race driving. BUT its too late now.

The GSKA follows the WKA rules and is a road racing club. They wouldn't let him race last month until he did this full test day. He looped it a few times by himself (runs in the family ) but ran great in traffic in a Briggs around other Briggs karts, sometimes 3 deep just before sorting out for a corner. Spun it on purpose to avoid another kart that had lost it right in front of him, avoiding contact. Never touched, but ran close to other drivers all day and wasn't even spooked when he was put out there with the Rotax guys!

He is 10 yrs old and this is a short track, BUT I can see the judgment skills already there. Last fall I felt a little different about "underage drivers" having a wing and corner removed from a car I was driving in a championship race, running good I'll have to say. when a KID bobbled on cold tires, lifted, lost it @100 mph and ruined our chance at a nice trophy! But then again Ive had a few corners removed by drivers that....well lets say were looking at their visor and not the road, who were and still are older than myself???

Ive seen 15 yr olds win track championships at our local dirt track and have seen Cole do great things in the SCCA. But have also seen young guys that were not properly trained and just turned loose on a field of expensive 100 mph + race cars! Thinking that daddy's $$ can pay for anything I tear up and never thinking about who will pay for everyone elses messed up car?

I always know who I'm racing against and usually know what they are going to do (Its my job as a driver), but during a start, all bunched up, all you can hope for is the best......BUT....that has nothing to do with AGE? Its not how old you are that makes you a "weapon" its your training and temperament. Some drivers WILL NEVER be any good.

I'm for better or more stringent requirements to get a license period. Some drivers have had very rocky starts only to turn out to be very fast.*** In fact the guys that start out slower/safer will always be behind the faster/ wilder guys.***

My little man will take over whatever Im driving when he can get a license, so in some ways Im for keeping it up there so I can drive longer? And I would say move over Cole but by then he will already be in NASCAR......or married....eather one will mess up a good road racing driver! But with the right ride eather one will also make you rich.

[Roger Eade]

is not a barrier to stupitity Mark, and agree fully with your comments, I have race with guys as young as 14, and guys who age is 70+, and while I'm no great driver myself, but on the most part manage to stay on the track, I have taken more knocks from older guys who still think they are the next world champion, than some of the younger guys. I have written here just what we do to encourage younger guys here into the sport, and most, if not all the younger drivers comeing into the sport in single seaters, are comeing up from karts, and have good skills from that, then they still have to sit a test and are watched in their driving.
In our club, where we get guys who are older, and most are due for zimmer frames, we give them three strips on the rear of the car, and you tend to give these guys a bit of room until you know they are not going to cut your water off into a turn, it seems to work ok, but here the age is 12 to get a national licence, but you can't drive a Formula Toyota until you are 16, so most start at Formula First (VW) then go to FF, and if you look at the history of Scott Dixon, you will see that he came up though that same system, and he turned out OK.
Roger

[Nicholas Belling]

I think cole is married now.. aren't you cole.. my crew guys at the runoffs were next to your dad and a lady.. maybe that was your mom....

IF so lucky guy to be able to race, have a wife (??), but lets say when cole has kids he's definitely not racing I bet.. all attention will be getting his daughter or son into Karting at some ridiculously young age.. thats when coles dad gets to get back into racing full time...

and I am sure he would be all for the 14 year olds in scca if his family could start at that age

[M.Sauce]

I personally think that with proper oversight a 14 year old can be safe and competitive.I do think that 14 year old kids need oversight and need screening before I would support them racing in Club Racing.I am sure there are plenty of 14 year olds that are ready to race in our club but I would be willing bet there are many more that are not.I don't think if we did allow 14 year olds to race with us there would be this huge surge of kids coming to SCCA.Either way we will not gain or loose that great a number of competitors in my opinion.

[Mark H]

Right Mike, I don't think that there are a bunch of 14 year olds bugging their dads to join. The kids that would race are ones that are already members?

[D.T. Benner]

From what I have seen with the 16 year olds that are racing with SCCA Formula Car classes so far IS-
They don't build or prep their own cars. So daddy writes a check.
Probably SCCA is a Step along the way to something Bigger?
JR. whacks a fellow racer,Dad writes check,JR. get's back on track.

Now is that true about ALL of them? No but are we really going to keep these kids in SCCA because we let them Race at 14? I don't think so as most at that age are just going to be passing thru. Just my 2 cents.

[Bob Devol]

If a kid is old enough to drive on the street, that sounds about right. 14 is really pushing it too far and that's what I expressed to my Area Director.

That said, we not only need to attract and keep more of the 16-20 year old drivers, we also need to recruit workers from the same age group.

[Steve Demeter]

I agree with DT.

Been on the wrong end of that scenario once.

It sucks.

[Mark H]

The karts are where a kid belongs.
Letting them drive at 14 will keep them in the club longer on their way through? I think that the only members that will be in favor of the 14 year olds driving are members with 14 year olds. I mean why would a guy without a kid nagging him to drive want to race against one, What is there to gain?? Either they will wreck you out or beat you? I don't know what is worse?

The worst part about being beat by a 15 year old at the dirt track was he could get away with anything. When he won if you tore him down in a protest it made you look like the only reason you did that was because you couldn't understand how a kid beat you.....you know he MUST be cheeting....right. Never thinking (or admitting ) that he could have out drove you?
When the will to win (drive) comes with talent, that is and unbeatable package. Drop all that in the mind and body of a kid with no fear......forget about it.......you can spend all the $$$, read all the books , do a ton of test days and work all night of the car and you will never beat that guy. Then put him in the best car with the best team....can you say Lewis Hamilton? No one not even the current 2 time world champion can keep up.

The hard part is to find out who are the true talents and who are the ones racing on papa's $$ just waiting to tear you up? When you get crashed out by someone who ran out of talent will it matter if he is 14 or 21? They are going to have to learn sooner or later? At least when they are 14 you can ground them without internet for pulling a stupid move? I can see it now...HEY why can't you come over and play today....Well I flipped a guy in an FE and then didn't mow the lawn?....Or was it I mowed the lawn with the FE and flipped the mower??

[Cole Morgan]

If I have a wife and kids I have a lot of explaining to do....

[SSpiffytoo]

IIRC, to run in an SCCA Solo event you have to have a valid drivers license. How many states give those to 14 year-olds? We all know how much more challenging Solo is compared to Club Racing, that must be the reason for that requirement. Not to cast aspersions on our Solo brethren, but I have found Club Racing to be a much more intense and challenging endeavor. And someday I might even get it right.

[Racer23]

DOn't forget that some of those 14 year old driver may infact have more experiance than even some of the seasoned drivers.

Think,
Quarter midgets at 4 1/2 yrs old
Karts at 7-8
Cars 7 years later at 14

14 - 4.5 = 9.5 years. But please double check my math.

Not to mention that in some forms they race every weekend and test a few times a week. But I wouldn't think SCCA would want someone with that much experience anyway.

What a shame. How is SCCA going to become a viable option for these rich kids whose parents think that they are going to be in the upper ranks of road racing by the time they are 18?

Speed is relative. I had more trouble driving a shifer kart than I did a GT-1 car 2 weeks later.

[DFR Dave Freitas]

Before you hate on the 14/15 year old drivers, go to an IKF, WKA or Stars race. Those kids drive like pros, even the slow ones. I would much rather race with a 14 year old karter than a 50 year old banker, if you get my drift.

[D.T. Benner]

Dave. I don't think there is anything like "Hate" involved here. No question most of these "Youngsters" have experience and ability. Club Racing tries to be All things to All People" and so you DO have the 50 year old Bankers who may/may not be as good as a 14 year old with 10 yers of racing behind him/her. BUT the level of ambition and motivation is different and can lead to some differences of opinion as to what is acceptable on track.
Thats why I think the experienced 14 year old is better off running in a Pro series or with a school seriers than mixed in with the 50 year old bankers of Club racing.?

[Daryl DeArman]

How is SCCA going to become a viable option for these rich kids whose parents think that they are going to be in the upper ranks of road racing by the time they are 18?

SCCA won't be a viable option, isn't now, and in my opinion hasn't been for quite some time. Apparently that is what most of the membership wants...

The 14YO's on their way up will find the best option to them/ They don't lose, they don't need the SCCA. Apparently the SCCA has decided they don't need them either...and maybe they don't now. I have to wonder how many of them will turn 25, realize they won't be the next superstar and will return to SCCA to club race? Probably not many, they will either hang up the helmet, go back to karting for fun, or race Vintage or Rally or whatever...but what would entice them to go back to the organization that didn't want them to begin with?

[RickyRacer]

Hey Benner,
Maybe you should go try hanging out with the 14 and 15 year olds so you get can update yourself with the current lingo. Dave didn't literally mean hate. It was used to describe the trash talking people are doing on the kids. In reality, I think most poeple are afraid of racing against the kids because they are going to get smoked. No more trophies for the seniors.

[D.T. Benner]

Ricky,I'm an Old Guy and didn't start road racing till I was 40 so like a lot of the more "mature" (thats what the more sensitive Old Guys prefer to be called) drivers I can accept that a younger driver in equal equipment will probably whip my sorry old butt in a heads up race. But you are probably right to some degree. What I think must be frustrating to the younger drivers who don't have a "Deep Pockets Dad" is seeing some FOM with a high dollar/high powered Ride who can't get out of his own way! You know the kind I mean that are so far behind the car that the are more Reacting to it than driving it!

[John Thompson]

I have heard talk of one of the Northeast clubs (FRCCA, Formula Pro) developing a series for drivers as young as 14, but I have not found anything yet. Anybody know of such a thing? Our son has been succesfully racing since he was 5 in Quarter Midgets and is ready to move on. He has over 350 main event starts at one of the most competitive tracks in the country, but is ready to turn right. Since has gotten hurt once in a Go Kart they are not an option as per Mom, but she has no problem with any Formula car with a roll bar.

[racer27]

Call FRCCA -- Yes they have a 14 & 15 year old program. I saw it advertised in last issue of speed sport news.

From memory (you'll have to verify with club) it is $20,000. It includes the race car (I believe you end up owning it), all race fees and some other extras like School, Crew passes, permit, etc.

I personally feel the for MOST Races this is a bit to young, but there may be mature gifted exceptions out there.

If intrested contact club HQ to get the finite details.

[Steven McWilliams]

My 14 year old son raced in the Endurance Karting program, and loved it. His first time out, he set his teams fastest lap, it held for about 5 1/2 out of the 6 hour race. He loved it. Now we're tryiing to build a Formula First together. It is a good starting ground for anyone getting into racing. Before he goes into club racing he wants to solo it just to get used to it. Somewhere I saw you can solo at 15, could he solo the first at 15?

[M.Sauce]

I don't know if it possible to quantify all 14 year olds.I do know that many 14 year old racers would have no problem competing in SCCA.How do we recognize the qualified versus the unqualified?I think we need to consider them seriously and figure out how they figure into SCCA's future.I believe this is an important issue.

[Jim Garry]

Before he goes into club racing he wants to solo it just to get used to it. Somewhere I saw you can solo at 15, could he solo the first at 15?

To compete in Solo, you need a driver's license, or you can compete in the Junior Driver's program (ages 12 to 18) but that has to be in karts. To compete in a Formula First in Solo he'd need a driver's license. Not a permit.

4.1 DRIVER’S CREDENTIALS
A.
Drivers must possess a currently valid automobile driver’s license. Any underage driver who has the legal authority (license or permit) to operate an automobile with restrictions on a public road may compete in a Stock, Street Touring, or Street Prepared class at Regional events, as long as the restrictions of the driving license or permit are met. If those restrictions require a passenger, and the Region allows passengers, that passenger must be either the driver’s parent or legal guardian or an approved instructor.


Jim

[Steven McWilliams]

THanks Jim, that gives us more time to work on a car. He can't ge his lisence until next April 2008.

[Racer23]

Qualify the drivers the same way as done before. Make them go to drivers schools and entrust upon the instructors to pass or fail their students. Nothing different.