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Here's the latest addition to the British Racecar article series:
A Close-up Look at Jim Johnson's March 729 Formula Ford (53 photos)
It's an exceptionally well presented car, isn't it!
Please let me know if I got facts crossed up in the write-up or captions so I can make any necessary corrections.
http://www.britishracecar.com/JimJoh...arch-729-A.jpg
Certainly a very good looking race car.:p
Gorgeous and fast,too. Jim's not only a fastidious preparer,but was uncommonly welcoming and gracious to me this season as a first year Sovren ford driver,calling and inviting me to coffee during the preseason. A real ambassador for our sport.
Hi Folks,
Beautiful Car and wonderfully restored! Also, another well written write up from BritishV8. I can't help but point out a couple conflicting details regarding the 719 to 729 transition and production. Below is a quote from the article.
"For 1971, March began constructing a second version of their Formula Three car, with a new full monocoque chassis design. Twenty March 713 Formula Three cars were built, nine with spaceframes and eleven of the new monocoque model. With introduction of the new chassis, March also introduced much fresher looking bodywork. Chisel styling was then in vogue, and March went with it. The new bodystyle carried over to Formula Fords too, although only four Formula Fords (a.k.a. March 719s) were built for the home market that year."
Actually to my understanding and to others and the Marchives is, the 719's never came with the Chisel Nose styling, and none were made for the Home Market (UK) The Models intended for the Home Market were labeled 718's. Not really Home Market anyways, just everywhere other than the US.(turns out only Canada really) The 719's of which March produced 3 of had the same Cigar Shaped Bodywork as the 718, but had a NACA Duct just ahead of the Dash in it's Nose. (these were the Noses that were developing lift, hence the update to the downforce creating Chisel shaped Nose) It is believed all three 719's went to Canada. Chassis #'s 719-2 and 719-3 going to British Columbia together after Tom Johnstone and Ric Forest visited the factory in the winter of 70-71 to order them. 719-1 is rumored to have been written off, or at least disappeared along the way. If anyone else knows of it's demise or survival, i'd love to hear of it. I have the communicaton papers between Bill Stone and Ric Forest and Tom Johnstone regarding the 719's that were imported together. Ric Forest got quotes to update his 719 with the 713 F3 Bodywork with Chisel Nose. This is the Car I now own 719-2. It's 713 Nose has since been replaced with a 729 Nose which is straight across the front instead of V shaped like an Eagle or Crosssle 30 whatever. The 71 F3 Car was the inspiraton for the 729's Nose and supposedly March provided four of the Frames to be used for the 72 Season to Wayne Mitchell Engioneering from Arch Motors along with authorizing production of those four. They may have gotten a head start at the end of 1971 on the Cars, but none were 719's. Green Plate US built Marches weren't here till the 72 season although they were copied from the F3 based Frames that were provided from March. A wealth of info on the UK built March Cars can be had from Scott Livingston and David Calafato who have owned several. Bill Stone presently lives in New Zealand and vintage races and is Ray Mallock's brother in law. I also have the original 719 Bodywork for the Car from Speacilised Moldings in gel coat as delivered before being updated.
So in summary, I have it that in 1971 March built 4 718 Formula Fords and 3 719 Formula Fords. This is also as listed here at http://www.marchives.com/ and click on chassis types. Two more links:
[FONT=Arial]http://thelolaregistry.com/Carsforsale/MARCH%20729/March_729_Formula%20Ford%20For%20Sale.htm[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial] [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial]http://www.motorsportretro.com/2011/10/march-formula-ford/[/FONT]
Here is my 719 Chassis# 2 (Blue Chassis Plate from Bicester, UK) as raced to the 2010 Monoposto Championship by Charles Livingston. Picture credits to whoever they belong to. Again, a great article as usual on a beautiful Car.
Cheers,
Wayne
Gentlemen, thank you for your very encouraging words! This was an especially satisfying article to work on. The light was very good at Seattle for photography that weekend, and it seemed I couldn't take a bad photo of the March if I'd tried. Also, I had a brand new gadget that helped tremendously: a digital voice recorder!
Wayne Lee is correct that there are indeed conflicting records - or at least conflicting memories. What I included in the article is from two (recorded) interviews of Wayne Mitchell. Before I talked to Wayne, I'd thrown together a very preliminary write-up which included Jim's information and also production numbers from the Mike Lawrence book. Wayne dismissed the production numbers right away and said (highly paraphrased) "I don't know who Mike Lawrence is, but I should know better than anyone how many cars I built. I built about fourteen March Formula Fords over a period that included 1971 and 1972... and whether they were 719s or 729s is just a technicality because they were all similar." The Marchives only give Wayne credit for building seven cars - all of them in 1972. Wayne was also very specific on the point that he built all the frames and bodies he used. I double checked this because I had seen the "AM" number stamped on Jim's frame... if indeed March provided Arch Motors built frames to him, Wayne doesn't remember them. I don't have a horse in this race or an ax to grind but my suspicion is that the written records are probably wrong and Wayne's memories might be less than crystal clear too. (It's been a long time!) I'm aware that at least one other (U.S. assembled) March 729 appears to have an AM series chassis number, as described here: http://www.motorsportretro.com/2011/...-formula-ford/ (Note that the seller is presenting it as follows "The chassis has a unique number 'AM72-4' stamped on a rear suspension component. This denotes that the chassis was the fourth made by Arch Motors in 1972 and the first to be imported into the States... 729-1 is the first car (of 11) produced by WME.")
Yes, I spoke with Wayne Mitchell on the phone last week and brought up when production started, when asking about oter spares issues, and sources. He was quite matter of fact that he built 719's as well. I don't doubt that he could of built the 7 or 11 or 14 729's, because the story I've heard from others as well was that 4 were authorized and 11 got built with March shipping over the initial four Chassis for them, that were copied for further production. I've heard Wayne is a great resource and very helpful from quite a few people. I would be curious if anyone has seen a Car with a Chassis Plate that's green, starting with a 719. If that's how he numbered them. Otherwise, how were they numbered. There should be some period pictures from the day around somewhere, and especially a Car as well.
Here is a picture of 719-3 from the early 70's of Tom Johnston's. It is now the one owned by David Calafato, which presently has a 708 Nose.
Cheers,
Wayne
Hi Folks,
Curtis, I hope not to sound like a knick picker, but I wanted to point out that the front Calipers on this Car and the Merlyn 11A article of yours are described as having Girling 14SP Calipers on the front. Those are actually referred to as being 14LF Calipers as there are no such animals known as 14SP's. SP Calipers are distinctive in having only the two cross bolts sandwhiching their assemblies where the LF14 have the four. Basically, the rear (12SP) Calipers were most widely used on the early Mk1 and Mk2 series Spitfires and the LF14's most common on the Mk3 Spitfires and same period Lotus as well as many other Sports Cars and Sedans.
Cheers,
Wayne
cool! anything else?
[FONT=Verdana]Hi Curtis,[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana]I think I'd be presumptuous to think that question is directed solely at me, as I'm no expert on March's of any variant, especially the 729's. Hopefully some people that can be considered authorities on March Formula Ford's will add to your in depth report on this beautiful Car. The only thing I will opine on from your research or observations on March Formula Ford's is this, based on the quote below.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana]"March never provided engine covers for their Formula Fords"[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana]All March Formula Ford's built as model years prior to 1972 came with Engine Covers, that covers Models 708, 709, 718 and 719's. I don't know what was standard equipment for 72 using some components that could of very well been built in 71 like the Frames WME stamped as such. Like he said, it only mattered when it was sold, or ready to be sold maybe, that matters. The other differences I see between the UK built FF's and WME have no bearing on anything particuliar to March 729's[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana]Having enjoyed reading and viewing the results of your work on a few occasions now, I will definitely contribute to your coffer for Brit Race Cars. I thank you for your fine reports and great photography. At least it’s a lot easier to edit a webpage than something going to Harper Collins for print, it can be updated as information necessitates. [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana]Cheers,[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana]Wayne[/FONT]
Did a PayPal donation and one for Apexspeed, it's been a while.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BritishV8
March factory records show the following on 1971 FF build at factory
718-1 Bill Stone (UK) rebuilt from 708-6
718-2 Colin Andrews (UK) rebuilt from 708-5
718-3 Chris Tipping (UK) by 1976 running FF in UK with Willie Moore [chassis plate observation 16 May 76]
718-4 Andrew Chatburn (UK) retained 1972, chassis plate observation 31 March 72
719-1 Gordon Dewar (Canada)
719-2 Ric Forest (Canada) frame AM71-5 by 1973 André Lorent, Calgary see Canadian Motorsport Yearbook, Dec. 73
719-3 Frame AM71-11 Tom Johnston
Very Informative Chris.
You're obviously privvy to info that no one else seems to have. What do you show for the year 1972? I know there's no complete UK production of a Formula Ford, but how about any AM Frames like the mysterious 4 that were supposedly the ones provided for US production? The UK records don't seem too sketchy to me, I'd say they're better than not having any. I'm glad you could confirm the 7 UK Cars total, 4- 718's and 3-719's especially.
Cheers,
Wayne
Wayne, sadly there are a couple years from the March records that didn't get "recovered" (pulled out the skip) when March went bust. 1972 is one of themQuote:
Originally Posted by Wayne Lee
We - that's me and a few other like-minded historians - have been able to reconstitute most of the 722 and 723 build run from period observations and SCCA log books. (Though we still need more on US/Canadian cars)
However, we can't do that on 729s because there are no observations, that we've seen so far. If there were log books on surviving cars that'd be a start
Guys, I know that 2 of the march chisel nose cars were in Mihigan in the early 70s
One belonged briefly to a friend Bob Schnieder who nnever raced it, it went thru
someone else and Bernie Fling bought it and raced it for a few years at Waterford and in SCCA races, we built a nose mould for one guy, then the car's disapeared,
this thread has been interesting!.
Dave Craddock
Okay! Thank you all for your very helpful posts. I've made a bunch of corrections/clarifications to the article and uploaded them this morning.
Very special thanks to Wayne Lee for contributing to the operating fund!!!
Is there anything else? If not, I'll try to keep my mind focused on upcoming articles in the series. I've got a Lola T200 and a couple Titan Formula Fords coming up quickly. Also a progression of excellent Brabham Formula-B cars and a couple McLarens, so stay tuned! Are any of you interested in tin-tops? Here's my very latest article: Walter Davies' 1971 Ford Escort RS1600
Sorry Curtis, I know you'd like to move on to your next project, but something I said that you used was misinterpreted or ill written by myself.
Quote from Article:
"Per Wayne Lee who currently owns 719-2, March updated the design of the chisel noses on 719-2 and 719-3 (at least) from previous models by adding a NACA-style duct forward of the instrument panel."
Those Noses aren't considered the Chisel Noses. They are the same as the 718 UK and Euro version basically still considered the Cigar Shaped Body Nose. Stock factory 719 issue. Why March put the NACA Duct on the 719's to differentiate them from the 718 I don't know. My Car was updated after delivery to the F3 Bodywork which is considered the Chisel Nose Style and the influence for the 729's Nose. This is the Nose that helped to negate lift if not really create any downforce. I don't mean to perpetuate the details, I just wanted to be clear on what I was saying. I'm sure 719-1 of Gordon Dewar's was the same whatever became of that Car. All 3 factory 719's would have looked like the picture in the thread of Tom Johnston's in Castrol livery.
Thanks,
Wayne
I'm a wreck if I don't start my day with Cheerios... How's this?
"Per Wayne Lee who currently owns 719-2, March updated the design of the cigar noses on UK-produced 719s from previous models by adding a NACA-style duct forward of the instrument panel."
Curtis, that's fine I guess. Whether it was an update or just making them different is just a matter of opinion since I can only see that it may have brought just a little more fresh air into the cockpit. If this was going into Autosport, I'd still be on you over the other issues already discussed but off line, like no US built 719's as has been told by WME when claiming to having built 12 when 4 were authorized as told by him. Two sources of this info wish to stay out of it and remain anonymous saying WME claimed to have repaired 719's but no builds. I don't know what to beieve for numbers. I think an owner registry might show some spread in 729 Chassis #'s evidently #7 was the last. I'm going to try to locate some owners of 729's in some wanted info threads to satisfy my curiosity.
I'm attaching a picture of a 71 March 718 taken at a Race Car Show in Paris. Compare this to the one of the 719 picture I attached in post #6 and you'll see the diffence is minimal except for the duct.
Keep up the good work!
Look forward to some Cheerios in the Morning!
Cheers,
Wayne
Earlier today I was musing over a photo of the one and only Oscar Formula Ford by Frank Boyles (ex Cooper), which featured a similarly placed and shaped duct! I'll try to attach the file (below)...
Just read the pieces on Walter Davies' Escort and the Merlyn of Howie Freeman, both are nicely done.
Thanks for all your efforts and please keep them coming. :thumbsup:
Rob, I've just posted another Canadian racecar article!
Rachel Nelson's 1965 Austin Cooper S
I would like to buy a March formula Ford from 1972 to race insingle seaters in Portugal ... didi sameone know were there is a car to sale ....
:checkered::checkered:
Quote:
Originally Posted by BritishV8
Hi Alexandre,Quote:
Originally Posted by Lola_T360
I wish you good luck in your search for a March 729, which was the first US built March model until March handed over production of their Sports 2000 Cars to another US builder calling them Apaches. Unfortunately, I don't believe production of the Cars was close to what has been written, possibly whatever survived from the supposed 11 that were built, 7 of which other than the Arch Motor Framed Cars , and #7 being the last. I suspect WME built the 7 additional Frames to add to the 4 he received from the UK making the total 11 March 729's. Iknow of a couple that have been exported to Australia and the UK. I think the 729 is a rarer beast than has been described. Anyone with 729's . please raise your hands!
Best Regards,
Cheers,
Wayne Lee
Douglas, MA
March 719 (719-2)
Hawke DL12 ex Keith Averill (CF)
Hawke DL11 (parts car)
Alexandre, try clicking on the link in post #5...
Really interesting reading about all this stuff. I have known Bill Stone for a few years - infact I store a car in his shed and he helps with welding and set up advice.
As mentioned he was empolyee number 1, built the first chassis. The chassis has his initials in the serial number I believe. He also built a March FF car for himself. He changed the chassis tubes from square to round, made it as light as possible. It was nicknamed the Starch. It ended up somewhere in the USA. He is a bit indifferent about March space frame designs.
Marty
Hi Marty, Bill Stone's first FF was the 708 he campaigned in 1970. It features above center in the Arch Motors Poster celebrating their 50th year anniversry that Andrew Kitson printed. The Car he built for himself (his second FF) could of been his 718 which was numbered 718-1 and built from 708-6 and referenced above by Lola_T360 from March Factory records.
You're a lucky man to have a distinquished friend who lets you use his Shed.
Hi Wayne,
Bill has a print of that art work hanging on his wall. I point out to him ocasionally that his is the only car painted with the back hanging out - what does that tell you. I dangled my Lotus 69 under his nose last year, did a you help fix and you can drive it offer. He raced it at the Chris Amon Fetival in Jan this year. Did really well in the rain - he was acknowledged as the rain master. Special award created overnight in his honour. Made a number of us sit up and take notice. He has great stories like breaking into Frank Wiliams warehouse at night to swap parts on a Brabham he had bought from Frank. At the end when they worked out the bill Frank added 200 pounds for the extra parts aquired !
Bill is still very interested in race car design and setup. He will help anyone with advice and suggestions. He is always happy to stop and chat to people. I joke to Bill that he is world famous - just not in NZ.
Regarding calipers - I have always refered to my calipers as SP12 and SP14. I have (may be mistakingly) thought that the SP12 was the early two bolt caliper. SP14 the later 4 bolt caliper. SP calipers have the brake line entering the caliper top vertical. LF calipers have the brake line entering in the centre horizontal.
I would like to get my hands on a March FF - none in NZ. May be one day.
Regards,
Marty
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wayne Lee
Hi Marty,
Yes, Andrew told me how Bill Stone's wife bought him a print of the Arch Motors Anniversary Art that he put together. I have #299 of 300, I'm sure he's got a low #. I've been away on holiday a bit and didn't see the response till now regarding the Calipers.
You're in all youir right to refer to your Calipers however You like. The truth is, there is no SP14 Girling Caliper. You can call them Bill and Shirley if you like. Regarding the top feed Caliper being a SP14, that is the common LF14 as prescribed for all Triumph Spitfire's since the Mk3. I've seen plenty modified for center feed as were on my Tiga SC80 S2 Car on the rear with Inboard Discs, Just to make sure , I touched base with other Girling Parts handler's here in the States, such as Dave Bean, Averill Racing Stuff etc.,, and no one has ever heard of any SP14's. I personally have seen them referred to as Type 14's on a couple of occasions,(meaning LF14) but try googling SP14's and let me know what you come up with, other than the Articles in question.
You can forward any news of previously unheard of Nomenclature to:
wayne@girlingbrakes.com
Hello nice to see this bit of informationQuote:
Originally Posted by BritishV8
I am John Nichols that was responsible for the Oscar F69. I left this car together with my Reynard F75 and Merlyn Mk20 in England when I came to Spain where I raced between 1986 and 1995 also taking in the Portuguese Championship for FF1800 and FF1600 that year
I still have my Van Diemen RF86 Reynard F88 and Reynard F89/92
Keeping in touch with motorsport with my site http://itcracing.blogspot.com
and trying to get a new motor racing resort off the ground
http://newracecircuit.blogspot.com
Hi WayneQuote:
Originally Posted by Wayne Lee
Bill Stone´s Sabre workshops in Bicester was used to construct my Reynard F75 (first production chassis) and I did meet him a few times but I guess he does not remember me after all these years
you may enjoy this slideshow which shows the F75 under construction in Bill Stone´s workshop http://youtu.be/hwrzaiYAvP4
and my early Formula Fords http://youtu.be/3QanIrUWVD4
and in 1989 video http://youtu.be/Xv9vTYtyLjc
Might be in MA next year as my two daughters live there
Im afraid Bill Stone died earlier this year in NZ
I am really sorry to hear the news about Bill Stone, especially having seen last night
Grand Prix - "The Killer Years" which I decided to publish on my site here
http://itcracing.blogspot.com/2012/0...s-sixties.html
I started in the sport in the sixties and of course a lot of what was said really did filter down the the lower Formulas such as Formula Ford 1600 so I could have an empathy with the people that commented.
The film Grand Prix in 1966 used Formula chassis with Formula 1 bodywork
http://youtu.be/y7xN0nauWpQ
hello all. sorry to hear of mr stone's passing . I am the owner of 718-1 . yes it has round tubes and and i have an early scca log book from 1973. been trying to bring the car back but ran out of funds when I found out the mk-8 needs a total rebuild/replacement. would like to see it move to a good home . thanks frank maderi